Keithr0 wrote:
> On 17/02/2024 7:56 pm, Mighty Mouse wrote:
>> alvey wrote:
>>> Noddy wrote:
>>>> Hey Trev. Could use your help if you feel like offering it.
>>>>
>>>> My kid's birthday is coming up in a couple of months and he'd like
>>>> a new stereo. He got a big kick out of his old Garrand 3500 based
>>>> stereo that I talked about here some time ago, but it's started to
>>>> be a bit unreliable and he'd love something a bit better. He
>>>> basically just wants a turntable as he loves vinyl and has no
>>>> interest in CD's or tapes, and with that in mind I have 2 questions
>>>> for you.
>>>>
>>>> Firstly, is there anything new on the market today that you would
>>>> recommend? I'm not looking for high end stuff, but don't want cheap
>>>> rubbish either. I'm not fussed about brands and I dare say neither
>>>> is he. It doesn't have to be anything elaborate. Just want
>>>> something that sounds reasonable. If you had any recommendations of
>>>> a system that could be put together on a budget of a thousand bucks
>>>> I'd be all ears.
>>>>
>>>> Secondly, if you don't think new stuff in that price range today is
>>>> worth owning, could you recommend any second hand stuff to look out
>>>> for? I see the odd 70's or 80's vintage Marantz, Pioneer or Yamaha
>>>> hifi systems come up on Marketplace occasionally, and wondered if
>>>> something of that nature (or anything else you could recommend)
>>>> would be a better bet instead?
>>>>
>>>> Appreciate any and all advice you may be able to offer.
>>>
>>> For the kid hey Fraudster? Sure it is. I believe you. Honest.
>>
>> not a good idea buying 40 or 50 year old electronic equipment, lol.
>> but his budget is too low for a decent HiFi sound system new.
>
> The electrolytic capacitors would be suspect, but the rest should be
> OK if it has been kept in a reasonable environment, and not abused.

not necessarily. with the repetitive cycle of heating and cooling from
use dry joints develop, semiconductors fail, corrosion on contacts,
etc., and amps that old have mechanical controls. the tracks wear on the
pots and the shaft lube dries out. lots of things.

>
>>> alvey
>>> And what teenage boy *wouldn't* want an old, 2nd hand music player
>>> that takes up half a room and produces seriously shithouse sound for
>>> his birthday?
>>>
>>
>> I have Kef Concerto main speakers for the TV surround sound system,
>> paired with a B&W centre and JBL rears. sounds good!
>>
> I've a pair of halfway decent speakers that I bought in 1988, even
> though we've moved house 7 times since then, they still sound just fine.

no reason why they wouldn't, except speaker suspensions (especially bass
drivers) can lose rigidity over time which can cause diaphragm flapping
and poling. also the failure of crossover components.

--
Have a nice day!..

On 19/02/2024 8:22 pm, Noddy wrote:
> On 19/02/2024 7:54 pm, Trevor Wilson wrote:
>> On 19/02/2024 3:32 pm, Noddy wrote:
>
>>> No worries. I did notice, and I see Lindsay's just chimed in with a
>>> Technic for sale. Given that he's closer I'll grab that from him, but
>>> I'll deal with you if there's anything I need for it.
>>>
>>> Thanks again for the help.
>>
>> **No probs. Lindsay's turntable is a very simple, belt drive model.
>> Not much to go wrong and parts should be generally available if
>> something does.
>
> Cool. Now I just need an amp and some speakers :)
>
>
>

**Now you need to call me and discuss. Unfortunately, I sold a pair of
speakers last week that would have been perfect.

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Trevor Wilson wrote:
> On 19/02/2024 3:32 pm, Noddy wrote:
>> On 19/02/2024 11:40 am, Trevor Wilson wrote:
>>> On 19/02/2024 11:10 am, Noddy wrote:
>>>> On 19/02/2024 8:07 am, Trevor Wilson wrote:
>>>>> On 16/02/2024 3:41 pm, Noddy wrote:
>>>>>> Hey Trev. Could use your help if you feel like offering it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My kid's birthday is coming up in a couple of months and he'd
>>>>>> like a new stereo. He got a big kick out of his old Garrand 3500
>>>>>> based stereo that I talked about here some time ago, but it's
>>>>>> started to be a bit unreliable and he'd love something a bit
>>>>>> better. He basically just wants a turntable as he loves vinyl and
>>>>>> has no interest in CD's or tapes, and with that in mind I have 2
>>>>>> questions for you.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Firstly, is there anything new on the market today that you would
>>>>>> recommend? I'm not looking for high end stuff, but don't want
>>>>>> cheap rubbish either. I'm not fussed about brands and I dare say
>>>>>> neither is he. It doesn't have to be anything elaborate. Just
>>>>>> want something that sounds reasonable. If you had any
>>>>>> recommendations of a system that could be put together on a
>>>>>> budget of a thousand bucks I'd be all ears.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Secondly, if you don't think new stuff in that price range today
>>>>>> is worth owning, could you recommend any second hand stuff to
>>>>>> look out for? I see the odd 70's or 80's vintage Marantz, Pioneer
>>>>>> or Yamaha hifi systems come up on Marketplace occasionally, and
>>>>>> wondered if something of that nature (or anything else you could
>>>>>> recommend) would be a better bet instead?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Appreciate any and all advice you may be able to offer.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> **There is nothing available, new, for less than around $500.00
>>>>> that is worth bothering with. JB Hi Fi specialise is selling utter
>>>>> rubbish.
>>>>>
>>>>> Which leaves with, IMO, the best value for money, quality second
>>>>> hand stuff. Obviously, that presents it's own risks, but
>>>>> turntables are generally operated under a very low stress
>>>>> environment and most can be expected to last many decades.
>>>>>
>>>>> Personally, the two brands I like most are Denon (Japan) and Dual
>>>>> (Germany). Dual is difficult, as the company no longer exists and
>>>>> there are aspect of some models that can make repair impossible.
>>>>> For instance:
>>>>>
>>>>> The original Dual 505 was a fine turntable, but fitted with a
>>>>> diabolically bad headshell. However, the Dual 505-2, 3, 4
>>>>> addressed that problem quite effectively. The 505 was a belt drive
>>>>> unit and drive belts are easily available, but the speed control
>>>>> belt is not. Dual also made a number of direct drive units and
>>>>> they are generally pretty decent. I would caution again the much
>>>>> older, rim drive Duals, as the idler can be very difficult to
>>>>> find. Motors are easy to rebuild. That said, the mechanisms are
>>>>> complicated (they're full auto) and are of such an age that a full
>>>>> strip down and re-lube will be required. OTOH, the 505 (and others
>>>>> in that range) are semi-auto and far simpler to sort out.
>>>>>
>>>>> Denon make all direct drive units. I like them. A lot. I presently
>>>>> have 11 of the suckers. I buy them in from Japan, tart them up a
>>>>> bit and re-sell. The downside is that they need a 230VAC - 110VAC
>>>>> step-down transformer (about $35.00) to work in Oz. The motors in
>>>>> Denons are works of art. Smooth as butter and they last forever.
>>>>> They come in manual, semi-auto and full auto. Because they're
>>>>> mechanisms are simpler than most, even their full auto models are
>>>>> a good buy.
>>>>>
>>>>> Technics are another, very popular, option. IMO, they are
>>>>> generally a bit over-priced, compared to Denon, due to their
>>>>> popularity with the disco people. Still, they are quite decent for
>>>>> the most part. Beware: Technics have built some real shit in their
>>>>> low end models.
>>>>>
>>>>> Rega is a fascinating Pommy success story. Fully manual, but
>>>>> excellent performers, built fairly cheaply. Tone arms are a one
>>>>> piece, magnesium casting. Genius. Counterweight is solid tantalum.
>>>>> Available new and used (the Rega Plannar 3 has been around for 40
>>>>> years).
>>>>>
>>>>> Anyway, feel free to give me a call to discuss your needs (bus
>>>>> hours please). 02 9589 1001
>>>>>
>>>>> I am always happy to talk the hind leg off a mule about audio.
>>>>
>>>> Thank you very much indeed Trevor. This kind of detailed response
>>>> is exactly why I asked you :)
>>>>
>>>> I've taken all this on board and will keep my eye out & see what I
>>>> can find, and I'll give you a call if I come across anything
>>>> specific that needs further investigation.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks again. It's greatly appreciated.
>>>>
>>>
>>> **In case you didn't pick up on what I said, I have several Denons
>>> that will be for sale, along with a couple of Direct drive Duals and
>>> a couple of Technics. Except for the Denons, they're all 230VAC
>>> models. The Denons are 100VAC versions, but I can supply suitable
>>> step-down transformers at cost price.
>>>
>>> I can post photos if you wish.
>>
>> No worries. I did notice, and I see Lindsay's just chimed in with a
>> Technic for sale. Given that he's closer I'll grab that from him, but
>> I'll deal with you if there's anything I need for it.
>>
>> Thanks again for the help.
>
> **No probs. Lindsay's turntable is a very simple, belt drive model.
> Not much to go wrong and parts should be generally available if
> something does.
>
>

err... no. SL-D3 is a direct drive

--
Have a nice day!..

On 20/02/2024 10:27 am, Mighty Mouse wrote:
> Trevor Wilson wrote:
>> On 19/02/2024 3:32 pm, Noddy wrote:
>>> On 19/02/2024 11:40 am, Trevor Wilson wrote:
>>>> On 19/02/2024 11:10 am, Noddy wrote:
>>>>> On 19/02/2024 8:07 am, Trevor Wilson wrote:
>>>>>> On 16/02/2024 3:41 pm, Noddy wrote:
>>>>>>> Hey Trev. Could use your help if you feel like offering it.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> My kid's birthday is coming up in a couple of months and he'd
>>>>>>> like a new stereo. He got a big kick out of his old Garrand 3500
>>>>>>> based stereo that I talked about here some time ago, but it's
>>>>>>> started to be a bit unreliable and he'd love something a bit
>>>>>>> better. He basically just wants a turntable as he loves vinyl and
>>>>>>> has no interest in CD's or tapes, and with that in mind I have 2
>>>>>>> questions for you.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Firstly, is there anything new on the market today that you would
>>>>>>> recommend? I'm not looking for high end stuff, but don't want
>>>>>>> cheap rubbish either. I'm not fussed about brands and I dare say
>>>>>>> neither is he. It doesn't have to be anything elaborate. Just
>>>>>>> want something that sounds reasonable. If you had any
>>>>>>> recommendations of a system that could be put together on a
>>>>>>> budget of a thousand bucks I'd be all ears.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Secondly, if you don't think new stuff in that price range today
>>>>>>> is worth owning, could you recommend any second hand stuff to
>>>>>>> look out for? I see the odd 70's or 80's vintage Marantz, Pioneer
>>>>>>> or Yamaha hifi systems come up on Marketplace occasionally, and
>>>>>>> wondered if something of that nature (or anything else you could
>>>>>>> recommend) would be a better bet instead?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Appreciate any and all advice you may be able to offer.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> **There is nothing available, new, for less than around $500.00
>>>>>> that is worth bothering with. JB Hi Fi specialise is selling utter
>>>>>> rubbish.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Which leaves with, IMO, the best value for money, quality second
>>>>>> hand stuff. Obviously, that presents it's own risks, but
>>>>>> turntables are generally operated under a very low stress
>>>>>> environment and most can be expected to last many decades.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Personally, the two brands I like most are Denon (Japan) and Dual
>>>>>> (Germany). Dual is difficult, as the company no longer exists and
>>>>>> there are aspect of some models that can make repair impossible.
>>>>>> For instance:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The original Dual 505 was a fine turntable, but fitted with a
>>>>>> diabolically bad headshell. However, the Dual 505-2, 3, 4
>>>>>> addressed that problem quite effectively. The 505 was a belt drive
>>>>>> unit and drive belts are easily available, but the speed control
>>>>>> belt is not. Dual also made a number of direct drive units and
>>>>>> they are generally pretty decent. I would caution again the much
>>>>>> older, rim drive Duals, as the idler can be very difficult to
>>>>>> find. Motors are easy to rebuild. That said, the mechanisms are
>>>>>> complicated (they're full auto) and are of such an age that a full
>>>>>> strip down and re-lube will be required. OTOH, the 505 (and others
>>>>>> in that range) are semi-auto and far simpler to sort out.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Denon make all direct drive units. I like them. A lot. I presently
>>>>>> have 11 of the suckers. I buy them in from Japan, tart them up a
>>>>>> bit and re-sell. The downside is that they need a 230VAC - 110VAC
>>>>>> step-down transformer (about $35.00) to work in Oz. The motors in
>>>>>> Denons are works of art. Smooth as butter and they last forever.
>>>>>> They come in manual, semi-auto and full auto. Because they're
>>>>>> mechanisms are simpler than most, even their full auto models are
>>>>>> a good buy.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Technics are another, very popular, option. IMO, they are
>>>>>> generally a bit over-priced, compared to Denon, due to their
>>>>>> popularity with the disco people. Still, they are quite decent for
>>>>>> the most part. Beware: Technics have built some real shit in their
>>>>>> low end models.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Rega is a fascinating Pommy success story. Fully manual, but
>>>>>> excellent performers, built fairly cheaply. Tone arms are a one
>>>>>> piece, magnesium casting. Genius. Counterweight is solid tantalum.
>>>>>> Available new and used (the Rega Plannar 3 has been around for 40
>>>>>> years).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Anyway, feel free to give me a call to discuss your needs (bus
>>>>>> hours please). 02 9589 1001
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am always happy to talk the hind leg off a mule about audio.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thank you very much indeed Trevor. This kind of detailed response
>>>>> is exactly why I asked you :)
>>>>>
>>>>> I've taken all this on board and will keep my eye out & see what I
>>>>> can find, and I'll give you a call if I come across anything
>>>>> specific that needs further investigation.
>>>>>
>>>>> Thanks again. It's greatly appreciated.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> **In case you didn't pick up on what I said, I have several Denons
>>>> that will be for sale, along with a couple of Direct drive Duals and
>>>> a couple of Technics. Except for the Denons, they're all 230VAC
>>>> models. The Denons are 100VAC versions, but I can supply suitable
>>>> step-down transformers at cost price.
>>>>
>>>> I can post photos if you wish.
>>>
>>> No worries. I did notice, and I see Lindsay's just chimed in with a
>>> Technic for sale. Given that he's closer I'll grab that from him, but
>>> I'll deal with you if there's anything I need for it.
>>>
>>> Thanks again for the help.
>>
>> **No probs. Lindsay's turntable is a very simple, belt drive model.
>> Not much to go wrong and parts should be generally available if
>> something does.
>>
>>
>
> err... no. SL-D3 is a direct drive
>

**Quite so. It's written right there on the front and the back.

[Smacks head]

--
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www.avast.com

On 20/02/2024 10:32 am, Trevor Wilson wrote:
> On 20/02/2024 10:27 am, Mighty Mouse wrote:
>> Trevor Wilson wrote:

>>>
>>> **No probs. Lindsay's turntable is a very simple, belt drive model.
>>> Not much to go wrong and parts should be generally available if
>>> something does.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> err... no. SL-D3 is a direct drive
>>
>
> **Quite so. It's written right there on the front and the back.
>
> [Smacks head]
>
Yep, goes to show how much i've been paying notice.. i said it may need
a new belt... :-) It's been sitting on the shelf with a dust rag over
it for at least a year, which is when I plugged it in, and took the
photos in preparation to advertise it.

On 19/02/2024 7:46 pm, Noddy wrote:
> On 19/02/2024 6:23 pm, lindsay wrote:
>> On 19/02/2024 3:34 pm, Noddy wrote:
>
>>>
>>> Sounds like a deal to me. I'll take it thanks. I'm not in a hurry, so
>>> I'll message you in a day or so and make a time to collect it.
>>
>> Cool.!!  Please note, i'm off to NZ on Sunday for 2 weeks, so it's
>> this week, or 3 weeks from now... :-)
>
> I've got stuff on this week, so enjoy your trip and I'll see you when
> you get back.

no worries... one thing I just remembered, it has an old power plug on
the end.. looks like Bakerlite. Would have been fitted when it was
bought back from Japan. You may want to swap it.. just letting you know.
>

Trevor Wilson wrote:
> On 20/02/2024 10:27 am, Mighty Mouse wrote:
>> Trevor Wilson wrote:
>>> On 19/02/2024 3:32 pm, Noddy wrote:
>>>> On 19/02/2024 11:40 am, Trevor Wilson wrote:
>>>>> On 19/02/2024 11:10 am, Noddy wrote:
>>>>>> On 19/02/2024 8:07 am, Trevor Wilson wrote:
>>>>>>> On 16/02/2024 3:41 pm, Noddy wrote:
>>>>>>>> Hey Trev. Could use your help if you feel like offering it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> My kid's birthday is coming up in a couple of months and he'd
>>>>>>>> like a new stereo. He got a big kick out of his old Garrand
>>>>>>>> 3500 based stereo that I talked about here some time ago, but
>>>>>>>> it's started to be a bit unreliable and he'd love something a
>>>>>>>> bit better. He basically just wants a turntable as he loves
>>>>>>>> vinyl and has no interest in CD's or tapes, and with that in
>>>>>>>> mind I have 2 questions for you.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Firstly, is there anything new on the market today that you
>>>>>>>> would recommend? I'm not looking for high end stuff, but don't
>>>>>>>> want cheap rubbish either. I'm not fussed about brands and I
>>>>>>>> dare say neither is he. It doesn't have to be anything
>>>>>>>> elaborate. Just want something that sounds reasonable. If you
>>>>>>>> had any recommendations of a system that could be put together
>>>>>>>> on a budget of a thousand bucks I'd be all ears.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Secondly, if you don't think new stuff in that price range
>>>>>>>> today is worth owning, could you recommend any second hand
>>>>>>>> stuff to look out for? I see the odd 70's or 80's vintage
>>>>>>>> Marantz, Pioneer or Yamaha hifi systems come up on Marketplace
>>>>>>>> occasionally, and wondered if something of that nature (or
>>>>>>>> anything else you could recommend) would be a better bet instead?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Appreciate any and all advice you may be able to offer.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> **There is nothing available, new, for less than around $500.00
>>>>>>> that is worth bothering with. JB Hi Fi specialise is selling
>>>>>>> utter rubbish.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Which leaves with, IMO, the best value for money, quality second
>>>>>>> hand stuff. Obviously, that presents it's own risks, but
>>>>>>> turntables are generally operated under a very low stress
>>>>>>> environment and most can be expected to last many decades.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Personally, the two brands I like most are Denon (Japan) and
>>>>>>> Dual (Germany). Dual is difficult, as the company no longer
>>>>>>> exists and there are aspect of some models that can make repair
>>>>>>> impossible. For instance:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The original Dual 505 was a fine turntable, but fitted with a
>>>>>>> diabolically bad headshell. However, the Dual 505-2, 3, 4
>>>>>>> addressed that problem quite effectively. The 505 was a belt
>>>>>>> drive unit and drive belts are easily available, but the speed
>>>>>>> control belt is not. Dual also made a number of direct drive
>>>>>>> units and they are generally pretty decent. I would caution
>>>>>>> again the much older, rim drive Duals, as the idler can be very
>>>>>>> difficult to find. Motors are easy to rebuild. That said, the
>>>>>>> mechanisms are complicated (they're full auto) and are of such
>>>>>>> an age that a full strip down and re-lube will be required.
>>>>>>> OTOH, the 505 (and others in that range) are semi-auto and far
>>>>>>> simpler to sort out.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Denon make all direct drive units. I like them. A lot. I
>>>>>>> presently have 11 of the suckers. I buy them in from Japan, tart
>>>>>>> them up a bit and re-sell. The downside is that they need a
>>>>>>> 230VAC - 110VAC step-down transformer (about $35.00) to work in
>>>>>>> Oz. The motors in Denons are works of art. Smooth as butter and
>>>>>>> they last forever. They come in manual, semi-auto and full auto.
>>>>>>> Because they're mechanisms are simpler than most, even their
>>>>>>> full auto models are a good buy.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Technics are another, very popular, option. IMO, they are
>>>>>>> generally a bit over-priced, compared to Denon, due to their
>>>>>>> popularity with the disco people. Still, they are quite decent
>>>>>>> for the most part. Beware: Technics have built some real shit in
>>>>>>> their low end models.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Rega is a fascinating Pommy success story. Fully manual, but
>>>>>>> excellent performers, built fairly cheaply. Tone arms are a one
>>>>>>> piece, magnesium casting. Genius. Counterweight is solid
>>>>>>> tantalum. Available new and used (the Rega Plannar 3 has been
>>>>>>> around for 40 years).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Anyway, feel free to give me a call to discuss your needs (bus
>>>>>>> hours please). 02 9589 1001
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I am always happy to talk the hind leg off a mule about audio.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thank you very much indeed Trevor. This kind of detailed response
>>>>>> is exactly why I asked you :)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I've taken all this on board and will keep my eye out & see what
>>>>>> I can find, and I'll give you a call if I come across anything
>>>>>> specific that needs further investigation.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks again. It's greatly appreciated.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> **In case you didn't pick up on what I said, I have several Denons
>>>>> that will be for sale, along with a couple of Direct drive Duals
>>>>> and a couple of Technics. Except for the Denons, they're all
>>>>> 230VAC models. The Denons are 100VAC versions, but I can supply
>>>>> suitable step-down transformers at cost price.
>>>>>
>>>>> I can post photos if you wish.
>>>>
>>>> No worries. I did notice, and I see Lindsay's just chimed in with a
>>>> Technic for sale. Given that he's closer I'll grab that from him,
>>>> but I'll deal with you if there's anything I need for it.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks again for the help.
>>>
>>> **No probs. Lindsay's turntable is a very simple, belt drive model.
>>> Not much to go wrong and parts should be generally available if
>>> something does.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> err... no. SL-D3 is a direct drive
>>
>
> **Quite so. It's written right there on the front and the back.

if it's Direct Drive it's NOT belt drive! surprised you don't know that

>
> [Smacks head]
>

--
“Atheism is the birth right of all human, remember that!”- hhyapster 7.4.23

"Christianity cannot prevail against reason, fact, and knowledge"

"Religion is not about truth, it's about lifestyle"

"God is a convenient explanation for what man does not understand.
The less that's inexplicable, the less the need for God."

lindsay wrote:
> On 20/02/2024 10:32 am, Trevor Wilson wrote:
>> On 20/02/2024 10:27 am, Mighty Mouse wrote:
>>> Trevor Wilson wrote:
>
>>>>
>>>> **No probs. Lindsay's turntable is a very simple, belt drive model.
>>>> Not much to go wrong and parts should be generally available if
>>>> something does.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> err... no. SL-D3 is a direct drive
>>>
>>
>> **Quite so. It's written right there on the front and the back.
>>
>> [Smacks head]
>>
> Yep, goes to show how much i've been paying notice.. i said it may
> need a new belt... :-)  It's been sitting on the shelf with a dust rag
> over it for at least a year, which is when I plugged it in, and took
> the photos in preparation to advertise it.

It doesn't have a belt. it's a Direct Drive turntable

--
Have a nice day!..

Mighty Mouse wrote:
> lindsay wrote:
>> On 20/02/2024 10:32 am, Trevor Wilson wrote:
>>> On 20/02/2024 10:27 am, Mighty Mouse wrote:
>>>> Trevor Wilson wrote:
>>
>>>>>
>>>>> **No probs. Lindsay's turntable is a very simple, belt drive
>>>>> model. Not much to go wrong and parts should be generally
>>>>> available if something does.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> err... no. SL-D3 is a direct drive
>>>>
>>>
>>> **Quite so. It's written right there on the front and the back.
>>>
>>> [Smacks head]
>>>
>> Yep, goes to show how much i've been paying notice.. i said it may
>> need a new belt... :-)  It's been sitting on the shelf with a dust
>> rag over it for at least a year, which is when I plugged it in, and
>> took the photos in preparation to advertise it.
>
> It doesn't have a belt. it's a Direct Drive turntable
>

p.s. pull the platter off and you will see

--
Have a nice day!..

On 20/02/2024 11:21 am, Mighty Mouse wrote:
> lindsay wrote:
>> On 20/02/2024 10:32 am, Trevor Wilson wrote:
>>> On 20/02/2024 10:27 am, Mighty Mouse wrote:
>>>> Trevor Wilson wrote:
>>
>>>>>
>>>>> **No probs. Lindsay's turntable is a very simple, belt drive model.
>>>>> Not much to go wrong and parts should be generally available if
>>>>> something does.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> err... no. SL-D3 is a direct drive
>>>>
>>>
>>> **Quite so. It's written right there on the front and the back.
>>>
>>> [Smacks head]
>>>
>> Yep, goes to show how much i've been paying notice.. i said it may
>> need a new belt... :-)  It's been sitting on the shelf with a dust rag
>> over it for at least a year, which is when I plugged it in, and took
>> the photos in preparation to advertise it.
>
> It doesn't have a belt. it's a Direct Drive turntable

I know. Thats what I, and Trevor, said above. No need to correct us
after we've corrected ourselves.
>

On 20/02/2024 4:39 am, Trevor Wilson wrote:
> On 19/02/2024 8:22 pm, Noddy wrote:

>> Cool. Now I just need an amp and some speakers :)
>>
>>
>>
>
> **Now you need to call me and discuss. Unfortunately, I sold a pair of
> speakers last week that would have been perfect.

I'll give you a yell once I pick the turntable up from Lindsay.

--
--
--
Regards,
Noddy.

On 20/02/2024 11:01 am, lindsay wrote:
> On 19/02/2024 7:46 pm, Noddy wrote:
>> On 19/02/2024 6:23 pm, lindsay wrote:
>>> On 19/02/2024 3:34 pm, Noddy wrote:
>>
>>>>
>>>> Sounds like a deal to me. I'll take it thanks. I'm not in a hurry,
>>>> so I'll message you in a day or so and make a time to collect it.
>>>
>>> Cool.!!  Please note, i'm off to NZ on Sunday for 2 weeks, so it's
>>> this week, or 3 weeks from now... :-)
>>
>> I've got stuff on this week, so enjoy your trip and I'll see you when
>> you get back.
>
> no worries... one thing I just remembered, it has an old power plug on
> the end.. looks like Bakerlite. Would have been fitted when it was
> bought back from Japan. You may want to swap it.. just letting you know.

No wukkas. I'll sort it out.

--
--
--
Regards,
Noddy.

lindsay wrote:
> On 20/02/2024 11:21 am, Mighty Mouse wrote:
>> lindsay wrote:
>>> On 20/02/2024 10:32 am, Trevor Wilson wrote:
>>>> On 20/02/2024 10:27 am, Mighty Mouse wrote:
>>>>> Trevor Wilson wrote:
>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> **No probs. Lindsay's turntable is a very simple, belt drive
>>>>>> model. Not much to go wrong and parts should be generally
>>>>>> available if something does.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> err... no. SL-D3 is a direct drive
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> **Quite so. It's written right there on the front and the back.
>>>>
>>>> [Smacks head]
>>>>
>>> Yep, goes to show how much i've been paying notice.. i said it may
>>> need a new belt... :-)  It's been sitting on the shelf with a dust
>>> rag over it for at least a year, which is when I plugged it in, and
>>> took the photos in preparation to advertise it.
>>
>> It doesn't have a belt. it's a Direct Drive turntable
>
> I know. Thats what I, and Trevor, said above. No need to correct us
> after we've corrected ourselves.
>>
>

that was not obvious

--
Have a nice day!..

On 20/02/2024 10:19 am, Maximus wrote:

Uh oh yet another felix 'nym

Keithr0 wrote:
> On 20/02/2024 10:19 am, Maximus wrote:
>
> Uh oh yet another felix 'nym
>

wasn't meant to happen

--
Have a nice day!..

On 19/02/2024 9:57 pm, Mighty Mouse wrote:

>>> not a good idea buying 40 or 50 year old electronic equipment, lol.
>>> but his budget is too low for a decent HiFi sound system new.
>>
>> The electrolytic capacitors would be suspect, but the rest should be
>> OK if it has been kept in a reasonable environment, and not abused.
>
> not necessarily. with the repetitive cycle of heating and cooling from
> use dry joints develop, semiconductors fail, corrosion on contacts,
> etc., and amps that old have mechanical controls. the tracks wear on the
> pots and the shaft lube dries out. lots of things.

Pots are easy to check, just wind them from end to end and listen for
crackles, replacement is a minor job. Corrosion on contacts will not
occur if it has been kept in a reasonable environment. Dry joints do not
develop, they exist from poor soldering, broken joints can occur from
heat cycling in badly designed or constructed equipment, but a good
thump will usually detect it.

The thing is to check it before buying or get someone who knows what
they are doing to check it for you.

Keithr0 wrote:
> On 19/02/2024 9:57 pm, Mighty Mouse wrote:
>
>>>> not a good idea buying 40 or 50 year old electronic equipment, lol.
>>>> but his budget is too low for a decent HiFi sound system new.
>>>
>>> The electrolytic capacitors would be suspect, but the rest should be
>>> OK if it has been kept in a reasonable environment, and not abused.
>>
>> not necessarily. with the repetitive cycle of heating and cooling
>> from use dry joints develop, semiconductors fail, corrosion on
>> contacts, etc., and amps that old have mechanical controls. the
>> tracks wear on the pots and the shaft lube dries out. lots of things.
>
> Pots are easy to check, just wind them from end to end and listen for
> crackles, replacement is a minor job.

but who is going to buy an amp that needs to have the pots replaced,
unless they're an electronics technical person who can do it themselves,
which noddy is not, as he has amply shown in this ng. also, the person
selling the amp may have just squirted the pots to keep them going ok
for a while.

> Corrosion on contacts will not occur if it has been kept in a
> reasonable environment.

which many are not, or maybe used in high humidity locations.

> Dry joints do not develop, they exist from poor soldering, broken
> joints can occur from heat cycling in badly designed or constructed
> equipment, but a good thump will usually detect it.

IOW dry joints develop over time, as I said. you could buy an amp that
works fine when you purchase it, then dry joints appear some time later
in normal use

>
> The thing is to check it before buying or get someone who knows what
> they are doing to check it for you.

that will not necessarily guarantee you won't have trouble with it
later. amps made in the 70's or 80's are now 50 odd years old! who in
their right mind would buy a 50 year old amp and expect to have no
problems with it, especially when amps only a few years old fail for all
sorts of reasons. semiconductors can fail, as I said in my original
post, and are far more likely to do so having had 50 years of use.

--
Have a nice day!..

On 22/02/2024 11:52 am, Mighty Mouse wrote:
> Keithr0 wrote:
>> On 19/02/2024 9:57 pm, Mighty Mouse wrote:
>>
>>>>> not a good idea buying 40 or 50 year old electronic equipment, lol.
>>>>> but his budget is too low for a decent HiFi sound system new.
>>>>
>>>> The electrolytic capacitors would be suspect, but the rest should be
>>>> OK if it has been kept in a reasonable environment, and not abused.
>>>
>>> not necessarily. with the repetitive cycle of heating and cooling
>>> from use dry joints develop, semiconductors fail, corrosion on
>>> contacts, etc., and amps that old have mechanical controls. the
>>> tracks wear on the pots and the shaft lube dries out. lots of things.
>>
>> Pots are easy to check, just wind them from end to end and listen for
>> crackles, replacement is a minor job.
>
> but who is going to buy an amp that needs to have the pots replaced,
> unless they're an electronics technical person who can do it themselves,
> which noddy is not, as he has amply shown in this ng. also, the person
> selling the amp may have just squirted the pots to keep them going ok
> for a while.

Any tech that charges more than half an hour to replace a pot is ripping
you off. More than one pot, add 10 minutes would be more than adequate.
Cost of a new pot ~$2. Worthwhile if it is good gear at a reasonable price.

>> Corrosion on contacts will not occur if it has been kept in a
>> reasonable environment.
>
> which many are not, or maybe used in high humidity locations.

If it's not a bottom feeding el cheapo device the plating should handle
most indoor environments.

>> Dry joints do not develop, they exist from poor soldering, broken
>> joints can occur from heat cycling in badly designed or constructed
>> equipment, but a good thump will usually detect it.
>
> IOW dry joints develop over time, as I said. you could buy an amp that
> works fine when you purchase it, then dry joints appear some time later
> in normal use

A dry joint is a solder joint not properly done in the first place.

https://www.nextpcb.com/blog/dry-solder-joint

They are rare on PCBs which, these days, are usually soldered
automatically. They are usually caused by too low a soldering iron
temperature, not enough flux, or most likely by trying to solder to a
contaminated surface or component.

>> The thing is to check it before buying or get someone who knows what
>> they are doing to check it for you.
>
> that will not necessarily guarantee you won't have trouble with it
> later. amps made in the 70's or 80's are now 50 odd years old! who in
> their right mind would buy a 50 year old amp and expect to have no
> problems with it, especially when amps only a few years old fail for all
> sorts of reasons. semiconductors can fail, as I said in my original
> post, and are far more likely to do so having had 50 years of use.
>
Some of the old stuff is a lot more reliable than recent units, they
didn't penny pinch as much in those days. Semiconductors rarely fail if
used withing their design limits, they do fail in cheap crap where cost
are cut by running components outside their design specs.

Keithr0 wrote:
> On 22/02/2024 11:52 am, Mighty Mouse wrote:
>> Keithr0 wrote:
>>> On 19/02/2024 9:57 pm, Mighty Mouse wrote:
>>>
>>>>>> not a good idea buying 40 or 50 year old electronic equipment,
>>>>>> lol. but his budget is too low for a decent HiFi sound system new.
>>>>>
>>>>> The electrolytic capacitors would be suspect, but the rest should
>>>>> be OK if it has been kept in a reasonable environment, and not
>>>>> abused.
>>>>
>>>> not necessarily. with the repetitive cycle of heating and cooling
>>>> from use dry joints develop, semiconductors fail, corrosion on
>>>> contacts, etc., and amps that old have mechanical controls. the
>>>> tracks wear on the pots and the shaft lube dries out. lots of things.
>>>
>>> Pots are easy to check, just wind them from end to end and listen
>>> for crackles, replacement is a minor job.
>>
>> but who is going to buy an amp that needs to have the pots replaced,
>> unless they're an electronics technical person who can do it
>> themselves, which noddy is not, as he has amply shown in this ng.
>> also, the person selling the amp may have just squirted the pots to
>> keep them going ok for a while.
>
> Any tech that charges more than half an hour to replace a pot is
> ripping you off. More than one pot, add 10 minutes would be more than
> adequate. Cost of a new pot ~$2. Worthwhile if it is good gear at a
> reasonable price.

that's easy to claim, not so easy to substantiate. some pots can require
significant dismantling to remove them. and some pots are unique, which
means you can't just jam any pot in there, and so they can be quite costly.

>
>>> Corrosion on contacts will not occur if it has been kept in a
>>> reasonable environment.
>>
>> which many are not, or maybe used in high humidity locations.
>
> If it's not a bottom feeding el cheapo device the plating should
> handle most indoor environments.
>
>>> Dry joints do not develop, they exist from poor soldering, broken
>>> joints can occur from heat cycling in badly designed or constructed
>>> equipment, but a good thump will usually detect it.
>>
>> IOW dry joints develop over time, as I said. you could buy an amp
>> that works fine when you purchase it, then dry joints appear some
>> time later in normal use
>
> A dry joint is a solder joint not properly done in the first place.
>
> https://www.nextpcb.com/blog/dry-solder-joint
>
> They are rare on PCBs which, these days, are usually soldered
> automatically. They are usually caused by too low a soldering iron
> temperature, not enough flux, or most likely by trying to solder to a
> contaminated surface or component.

yes, I know but solder joints that fail, for whatever reason, are called
dry joints.

>
>>> The thing is to check it before buying or get someone who knows what
>>> they are doing to check it for you.
>>
>> that will not necessarily guarantee you won't have trouble with it
>> later. amps made in the 70's or 80's are now 50 odd years old! who in
>> their right mind would buy a 50 year old amp and expect to have no
>> problems with it, especially when amps only a few years old fail for
>> all sorts of reasons. semiconductors can fail, as I said in my
>> original post, and are far more likely to do so having had 50 years
>> of use.
>>
> Some of the old stuff is a lot more reliable than recent units, they
> didn't penny pinch as much in those days.

yes. but I wouldn't recommend anyone buy equipment 50 years old, as
noddy was asking about

> Semiconductors rarely fail if used withing their design limits, they
> do fail in cheap crap where cost are cut by running components outside
> their design specs.

or often due to poor circuit design.

--
Have a nice day!..

On 22/02/2024 10:43 am, Keithr0 wrote:
> On 19/02/2024 9:57 pm, Mighty Mouse wrote:
>
>>>> not a good idea buying 40 or 50 year old electronic equipment, lol.
>>>> but his budget is too low for a decent HiFi sound system new.
>>>
>>> The electrolytic capacitors would be suspect, but the rest should be
>>> OK if it has been kept in a reasonable environment, and not abused.
>>
>> not necessarily. with the repetitive cycle of heating and cooling from
>> use dry joints develop, semiconductors fail, corrosion on contacts,
>> etc., and amps that old have mechanical controls. the tracks wear on
>> the pots and the shaft lube dries out. lots of things.
>
> Pots are easy to check, just wind them from end to end and listen for
> crackles, replacement is a minor job.

**It MAY be an easy job. Or not. It depends on the amp. Additionally and
more seriously, is if the pots are still available. Substituting pots is
often quite difficult. Some modern amps use very high quality pots,
using plastic tracks. IME, they can last a VERY long time. That said,
the cost to the manufacturer of such a pot is in the order of US$20.00
or so. A low cost pot can cost US$0.20. Guess which one is most often
chosen? These are the ones I have in my (pre)amp:

https://au.rs-online.com/web/p/potentiometers/2346617?cm_mmc=AU-PLA-DS3A-_-google-_-PLA_AU_Pmax_LocalStock_0923-_--_-&matchtype=&&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIuNTygvi9hAMVMKlmAh174Qc2EAQYBiABEgIEXvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

Corrosion on contacts will not
> occur if it has been kept in a reasonable environment.

**Only if the switch contacts are gold plated. Otherwise, they will
suffer, regardless of the environment.

Dry joints do not
> develop, they exist from poor soldering, broken joints can occur from
> heat cycling in badly designed or constructed equipment, but a good
> thump will usually detect it.

**Yep.

>
> The thing is to check it before buying or get someone who knows what
> they are doing to check it for you.

**Obviously.

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On 22/02/2024 1:13 pm, Keithr0 wrote:
> On 22/02/2024 11:52 am, Mighty Mouse wrote:
>> Keithr0 wrote:
>>> On 19/02/2024 9:57 pm, Mighty Mouse wrote:
>>>
>>>>>> not a good idea buying 40 or 50 year old electronic equipment,
>>>>>> lol. but his budget is too low for a decent HiFi sound system new.
>>>>>
>>>>> The electrolytic capacitors would be suspect, but the rest should
>>>>> be OK if it has been kept in a reasonable environment, and not abused.
>>>>
>>>> not necessarily. with the repetitive cycle of heating and cooling
>>>> from use dry joints develop, semiconductors fail, corrosion on
>>>> contacts, etc., and amps that old have mechanical controls. the
>>>> tracks wear on the pots and the shaft lube dries out. lots of things.
>>>
>>> Pots are easy to check, just wind them from end to end and listen for
>>> crackles, replacement is a minor job.
>>
>> but who is going to buy an amp that needs to have the pots replaced,
>> unless they're an electronics technical person who can do it
>> themselves, which noddy is not, as he has amply shown in this ng.
>> also, the person selling the amp may have just squirted the pots to
>> keep them going ok for a while.
>
> Any tech that charges more than half an hour to replace a pot is ripping
> you off. More than one pot, add 10 minutes would be more than adequate.
> Cost of a new pot ~$2. Worthwhile if it is good gear at a reasonable price.

**That would be a gross over-simplification. Some pots cost more. MUCH
more. Some pots are VERY difficult to change. Most pots in equipment
that is more than (say) 15 years old, are NLA. Cleaning may be the only
solution.

>
>>> Corrosion on contacts will not occur if it has been kept in a
>>> reasonable environment.
>>
>> which many are not, or maybe used in high humidity locations.
>
> If it's not a bottom feeding el cheapo device the plating should handle
> most indoor environments.

**Trust me: It doesn't.

>
>>> Dry joints do not develop, they exist from poor soldering, broken
>>> joints can occur from heat cycling in badly designed or constructed
>>> equipment, but a good thump will usually detect it.
>>
>> IOW dry joints develop over time, as I said. you could buy an amp that
>> works fine when you purchase it, then dry joints appear some time
>> later in normal use
>
> A dry joint is a solder joint not properly done in the first place.

**A solder joint that has been subject to long-term high temperatures
(ca. 150 degrees C) can fail, despite the joint being done correctly.

>
> https://www.nextpcb.com/blog/dry-solder-joint
>
> They are rare on PCBs which, these days, are usually soldered
> automatically. They are usually caused by too low a soldering iron
> temperature, not enough flux, or most likely by trying to solder to a
> contaminated surface or component.
>
>>> The thing is to check it before buying or get someone who knows what
>>> they are doing to check it for you.
>>
>> that will not necessarily guarantee you won't have trouble with it
>> later. amps made in the 70's or 80's are now 50 odd years old! who in
>> their right mind would buy a 50 year old amp and expect to have no
>> problems with it, especially when amps only a few years old fail for
>> all sorts of reasons. semiconductors can fail, as I said in my
>> original post, and are far more likely to do so having had 50 years of
>> use.
>>
> Some of the old stuff is a lot more reliable than recent units, they
> didn't penny pinch as much in those days. Semiconductors rarely fail if
> used withing their design limits, they do fail in cheap crap where cost
> are cut by running components outside their design specs.

**Yes and, no. Electrolytic capacitors aside, plastic pack transistors
used in 1970s vintage equipment frequently fail. By the early 1980s,
transistor manufacturers had learned how to make reliable plastic pack
transistors. That said, many quality manufacturers used metal can
transistors during the 1970s. Those devices are likely to outlast our Sun.

Modern manufacturers of quality equipment tend not to penny-pinch.
Budget manufacturers do what they have always done - penny-pench.

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Trevor Wilson wrote:
> On 22/02/2024 10:43 am, Keithr0 wrote:
>> On 19/02/2024 9:57 pm, Mighty Mouse wrote:
>>
>>>>> not a good idea buying 40 or 50 year old electronic equipment,
>>>>> lol. but his budget is too low for a decent HiFi sound system new.
>>>>
>>>> The electrolytic capacitors would be suspect, but the rest should
>>>> be OK if it has been kept in a reasonable environment, and not abused.
>>>
>>> not necessarily. with the repetitive cycle of heating and cooling
>>> from use dry joints develop, semiconductors fail, corrosion on
>>> contacts, etc., and amps that old have mechanical controls. the
>>> tracks wear on the pots and the shaft lube dries out. lots of things.
>>
>> Pots are easy to check, just wind them from end to end and listen for
>> crackles, replacement is a minor job.
>
> **It MAY be an easy job. Or not. It depends on the amp. Additionally
> and more seriously, is if the pots are still available. Substituting
> pots is often quite difficult.

yep

> Some modern amps use very high quality pots, using plastic tracks.
> IME, they can last a VERY long time. That said, the cost to the
> manufacturer of such a pot is in the order of US$20.00 or so. A low
> cost pot can cost US$0.20. Guess which one is most often chosen? These
> are the ones I have in my (pre)amp:
>
> https://au.rs-online.com/web/p/potentiometers/2346617?cm_mmc=AU-PLA-DS3A-_-google-_-PLA_AU_Pmax_LocalStock_0923-_--_-&matchtype=&&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIuNTygvi9hAMVMKlmAh174Qc2EAQYBiABEgIEXvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds
>
>
>>
>>  Corrosion on contacts will not occur if it has been kept in a
>> reasonable environment.
>
> **Only if the switch contacts are gold plated. Otherwise, they will
> suffer, regardless of the environment.

exactly

>
>
>>  Dry joints do not develop, they exist from poor soldering, broken
>> joints can occur from heat cycling in badly designed or constructed
>> equipment, but a good thump will usually detect it.
>
> **Yep.

poor soldering is the cause of dry joints, but there's no dry joint
until the joint fails. while there's still conductivity it's not a dry
joint.

>
>>
>> The thing is to check it before buying or get someone who knows what
>> they are doing to check it for you.
>
> **Obviously.
>
>

--
Have a nice day!..

On 22/02/2024 5:38 pm, Mighty Mouse wrote:
> Trevor Wilson wrote:
>> On 22/02/2024 10:43 am, Keithr0 wrote:
>>> On 19/02/2024 9:57 pm, Mighty Mouse wrote:
>>>
>>>>>> not a good idea buying 40 or 50 year old electronic equipment,
>>>>>> lol. but his budget is too low for a decent HiFi sound system new.
>>>>>
>>>>> The electrolytic capacitors would be suspect, but the rest should
>>>>> be OK if it has been kept in a reasonable environment, and not abused.
>>>>
>>>> not necessarily. with the repetitive cycle of heating and cooling
>>>> from use dry joints develop, semiconductors fail, corrosion on
>>>> contacts, etc., and amps that old have mechanical controls. the
>>>> tracks wear on the pots and the shaft lube dries out. lots of things.
>>>
>>> Pots are easy to check, just wind them from end to end and listen for
>>> crackles, replacement is a minor job.
>>
>> **It MAY be an easy job. Or not. It depends on the amp. Additionally
>> and more seriously, is if the pots are still available. Substituting
>> pots is often quite difficult.
>
> yep
>
>> Some modern amps use very high quality pots, using plastic tracks.
>> IME, they can last a VERY long time. That said, the cost to the
>> manufacturer of such a pot is in the order of US$20.00 or so. A low
>> cost pot can cost US$0.20. Guess which one is most often chosen? These
>> are the ones I have in my (pre)amp:
>>
>> https://au.rs-online.com/web/p/potentiometers/2346617?cm_mmc=AU-PLA-DS3A-_-google-_-PLA_AU_Pmax_LocalStock_0923-_--_-&matchtype=&&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIuNTygvi9hAMVMKlmAh174Qc2EAQYBiABEgIEXvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds
>>
>>>
>>>  Corrosion on contacts will not occur if it has been kept in a
>>> reasonable environment.
>>
>> **Only if the switch contacts are gold plated. Otherwise, they will
>> suffer, regardless of the environment.
>
> exactly
>
>>
>>
>>>  Dry joints do not develop, they exist from poor soldering, broken
>>> joints can occur from heat cycling in badly designed or constructed
>>> equipment, but a good thump will usually detect it.
>>
>> **Yep.
>
> poor soldering is the cause of dry joints, but there's no dry joint
> until the joint fails. while there's still conductivity it's not a dry
> joint.
>

**I've seen a variety of dry joints that have lasted for decades. Until
they don't. Usually, it's due to a contaminant on the lead/s of a device
and the solder does not properly 'wet' the joint. As I stated,
sometimes, the device can function normally for many years and then the
corrosion finally causes a failure. Usually though, it's due to
vibration or high temperatures that causes a gradual failure of the
joint. 150 degrees C over a decade or so will cause damage to most
solder joints.

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On 22/2/2024 3:29 pm, Trevor Wilson wrote:
> On 22/02/2024 1:13 pm, Keithr0 wrote:
>> On 22/02/2024 11:52 am, Mighty Mouse wrote:
>>> Keithr0 wrote:
>>>> On 19/02/2024 9:57 pm, Mighty Mouse wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>>> not a good idea buying 40 or 50 year old electronic equipment,
>>>>>>> lol. but his budget is too low for a decent HiFi sound system new.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The electrolytic capacitors would be suspect, but the rest should
>>>>>> be OK if it has been kept in a reasonable environment, and not
>>>>>> abused.
>>>>>
>>>>> not necessarily. with the repetitive cycle of heating and cooling
>>>>> from use dry joints develop, semiconductors fail, corrosion on
>>>>> contacts, etc., and amps that old have mechanical controls. the
>>>>> tracks wear on the pots and the shaft lube dries out. lots of things.
>>>>
>>>> Pots are easy to check, just wind them from end to end and listen
>>>> for crackles, replacement is a minor job.
>>>
>>> but who is going to buy an amp that needs to have the pots replaced,
>>> unless they're an electronics technical person who can do it
>>> themselves, which noddy is not, as he has amply shown in this ng.
>>> also, the person selling the amp may have just squirted the pots to
>>> keep them going ok for a while.
>>
>> Any tech that charges more than half an hour to replace a pot is
>> ripping you off. More than one pot, add 10 minutes would be more than
>> adequate. Cost of a new pot ~$2. Worthwhile if it is good gear at a
>> reasonable price.
>
> **That would be a gross over-simplification. Some pots cost more. MUCH
> more. Some pots are VERY difficult to change. Most pots in equipment
> that is more than (say) 15 years old, are NLA. Cleaning may be the only
> solution.
>
>>
>>>> Corrosion on contacts will not occur if it has been kept in a
>>>> reasonable environment.
>>>
>>> which many are not, or maybe used in high humidity locations.
>>
>> If it's not a bottom feeding el cheapo device the plating should
>> handle most indoor environments.
>
> **Trust me: It doesn't.
>
>>
>>>> Dry joints do not develop, they exist from poor soldering, broken
>>>> joints can occur from heat cycling in badly designed or constructed
>>>> equipment, but a good thump will usually detect it.
>>>
>>> IOW dry joints develop over time, as I said. you could buy an amp
>>> that works fine when you purchase it, then dry joints appear some
>>> time later in normal use
>>
>> A dry joint is a solder joint not properly done in the first place.
>
> **A solder joint that has been subject to long-term high temperatures
> (ca. 150 degrees C) can fail, despite the joint being done correctly.
>
Seem them fail in high frequency environments too. Basically a form of
fatigue failure.
>>
>> https://www.nextpcb.com/blog/dry-solder-joint
>>
>> They are rare on PCBs which, these days, are usually soldered
>> automatically. They are usually caused by too low a soldering iron
>> temperature, not enough flux, or most likely by trying to solder to a
>> contaminated surface or component.
>>
>>>> The thing is to check it before buying or get someone who knows what
>>>> they are doing to check it for you.
>>>
>>> that will not necessarily guarantee you won't have trouble with it
>>> later. amps made in the 70's or 80's are now 50 odd years old! who in
>>> their right mind would buy a 50 year old amp and expect to have no
>>> problems with it, especially when amps only a few years old fail for
>>> all sorts of reasons. semiconductors can fail, as I said in my
>>> original post, and are far more likely to do so having had 50 years
>>> of use.
>>>
>> Some of the old stuff is a lot more reliable than recent units, they
>> didn't penny pinch as much in those days. Semiconductors rarely fail
>> if used withing their design limits, they do fail in cheap crap where
>> cost are cut by running components outside their design specs.
>
> **Yes and, no. Electrolytic capacitors aside, plastic pack transistors
> used in 1970s vintage equipment frequently fail. By the early 1980s,
> transistor manufacturers had learned how to make reliable plastic pack
> transistors. That said, many quality manufacturers used metal can
> transistors during the 1970s. Those devices are likely to outlast our Sun.
>
> Modern manufacturers of quality equipment tend not to penny-pinch.
> Budget manufacturers do what they have always done - penny-pench.
>
>

--
Xeno

Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
(with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)