Atheism is a belief, it's not a science.

Case closed. I don't want to hear none of your lip!

Do I make myself clear?

--
The Starmaker -- To question the unquestionable, ask the unaskable,
to think the unthinkable, mention the unmentionable, say the unsayable,
and challenge the unchallengeable.

On 4/27/2024 12:57 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
> Atheism is a belief, it's not a science.
>
>
> Case closed. I don't want to hear none of your lip!
>
> Do I make myself clear?
>
>

Unless you state this in person, while holding a wooden discipline
paddle, no one is going to take what you say seriously; they may even
ignore you. I speak from experience here.

Dawn

The Starmaker wrote:
> Atheism is a belief, it's not a science.
>
>
> Case closed. I don't want to hear none of your lip!
>
> Do I make myself clear?
>
>
yea but i make you messed up again

On 28/04/2024 3:57 am, The Starmaker wrote:
> Atheism is a belief, it's not a science.
>
>
> Case closed. I don't want to hear none of your lip!
>
> Do I make myself clear?

Yes, very.

And very obvious, but not to the genius atheist.

Michael Christ

--
God is God in all His Being.

Jesus is the everlasting Father, Jesus is God, Jesus is the Lord. John
10:30  I and Father are one. If you can't see that the Lord Jesus is the
everlasting Father you are not born again and can't see the Kingdom of God.

Colossians 2:9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

Rom 5:8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were
YET sinners, Christ died for us.

Jeremiah 10:23 O LORD, I know that the way of man is not in himself: it
is not in man that walketh to direct his steps.

Psalms 53:1 The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. Corrupt
are they, and have done abominable iniquity: there is none that doeth good.

Proverbs 12:15 The way of a fool is right in his own eyes: but he that
hearkeneth unto counsel is wise.

"To seek your own will is to seek your own glory."

"If God is not first in everything He is not first in anything."

"What makes the bible the truth? The resonance (voice, the Person) of
God. When you find Him you have found the author."

"All men were born sinners. Why? Because all men were born not loving
God with all their heart, soul, and mind. An abomination. Therefore,
sin is not what you do; it is what you are."

"Compromise will condemn you."

"There are no sinners in Christ Jesus."

"My sons are born of Me. In them is no darkness at all."

"You can't learn righteousness. Haven't you had enough time already to
know that?"

"The way of truth is the testimony of life."

"I merely speak the truth, what is revealed to me, and the cards fall
where God intends."

"Nothing that is produced is produced without first being faith."

"You can only find proof of God through faith because that is how we all
live, by faith."

"It is not what you do that matters, it is how you treat Me."

"Keep going forward. Forget about the past. Lift up your head, look
ahead."

"You cannot be free and free indeed with guilt in your heart."

"Priority is everything."

"The truth doesn't need evidence, it is evidence."

"There is no greater possession a man has than his own will, to squander
it or to place it where it truly belongs."

"An atheist is a fool who thinks truth is found in living a lie."

"Saying "prove it" [as a foundation] is merely an ignorant straw man, to
an ignorant straw man."

"Wait, rest, be still, and know."

"No man can wash his own hands!!!"

"I find this in the Christianity religions: 'Nobody's perfect' they say,
and they use that as an excuse not to do what is perfect."

The Atheist: "They don't believe and put their faith in a Creator (the
obvious). So no evidence and proof is to be found!!"

"The world is the way it is because God can't compromise who He is."

"Man is not the centre of being."

"Man is incompatible with the natural world because of his sinful nature."

"And then the Lord said, "I see everything."

"Man has no greater idol than his own will."

"Where is God hiding? He isn't."

"If you don't keep all the scriptures, you can't keep any of them."

"You can't prove anything because everything depends on a person's
willingness to believe."

"Atheists are ultimately trying to be pointlessness, meaninglessness,
and purposelessness in their point, meaning, and purpose."

"The last day of creation will be the last day of time. God is always
full of hope."

"The veil of the temple was rent in twain, not to have a book pass
through it so that a sinner could play God."

"A phylactery does not a heart for God make. Not back then, and not today."

"No one in heaven is better (or higher) than what makes it heaven. Such
is the love of God."

"The definition of an atheist: A man full of bluster and bullshit
pretending he is the meaning of life."

"Free will is not power; it is the choice that I allow; that choice is
still according to my power," says the Lord.

What does a fool do? A fool looks for a "nothing" in a "something" in
order to explain the existence of existence.

"Unless you do all because He is who He is, all your religion is in vain."

"Every man is subject to God; He judges every man, and He is reality.
 What a gift in a fallen world!"

"Love MUST be a choice or it is nothing but a law!"

"Why were all men born sinners? So that God could reveal Himself, so
that we would behold the glory of God, and that we should bring forth
the glory of God"

"God does not and will not arbitrate for any man to love Him! If God
isn't everything to you, He is nothing to you where the rubber meets the
road."

"It is the unforgivable sin not to love God with all your heart, soul,
and mind. What do you have that is lasting? It is not so much being
punished; it is what you are left with."

"Love isn't worth anything without first a free will choice for God to
birth it in a man."

"The point of salvation: desperation. Anything less than that is
self-righteousness."

"A sinner is not a believer in God; a sinner is a believer in sin."

"A piece of dirt is not the promised land; that is only a reflection.
The promised land is knowing Me, says the Lord."

"It is all about God or it is all about idolatry."

"The Lord Jesus is coming soon. He has always come soon."

"There is no revolving door of self-worship in a son of God's life!"

"There is no such thing as random!"

"You can't truly love without it being with all your heart."

"No one can see God without their whole heart. Unless you can see God,
you know nothing."

"You can't learn God, God has to reveal Himself to you."

"No sinner is sinless in any way."

"Only God is life; only the Kingdom of God of His "Nature" is life."

"What you believe is just a leaning on your own understanding; faith is
a leaning on the one you have chosen to trust."

"God uses the "letter" to crucify a man and raise him from the dead."

"Not fearing God is sheer stupidity for sinners."

"Self-righteousness is any exclusion of God in your heart, because any
exclusion reveals that you think more about yourself than what you
really are."

The Starmaker wrote:
>
> Atheism is a belief, it's not a science.

Religious beliefs and Atheism beliefs are both on the same level of ...beliefs.

Atheist are confident that there is no God, as Religions are confident that there is a God.

They are are both on the same level of ...beliefs.

--
The Starmaker -- To question the unquestionable, ask the unaskable,
to think the unthinkable, mention the unmentionable, say the unsayable,
and challenge the unchallengeable.

On 4/28/2024 11:38 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
> The Starmaker wrote:
>>
>> Atheism is a belief, it's not a science.
>
> Religious beliefs and Atheism beliefs are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
>
>
> Atheist are confident that there is no God, as Religions are confident that there is a God.
>
>
>
> They are are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
>

No atheist thinks this way. Have your read Professor Richard Dawkins'
The God Delusion?

Dawn

Dawn Flood wrote:
>
> On 4/28/2024 11:38 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
> > The Starmaker wrote:
> >>
> >> Atheism is a belief, it's not a science.
> >
> > Religious beliefs and Atheism beliefs are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
> >
> >
> > Atheist are confident that there is no God, as Religions are confident that there is a God.
> >
> >
> >
> > They are are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
> >
>
> No atheist thinks this way. Have your read Professor Richard Dawkins'
> The God Delusion?
>
> Dawn

Richard Dawkins is NOT an atheists, and Richard Dawkins NEVER claimed to be an atheists!

So the book is garbage..

and it belongs in the garbage can. It is a fraudulent book.

snake oil salesmen.

--
The Starmaker -- To question the unquestionable, ask the unaskable,
to think the unthinkable, mention the unmentionable, say the unsayable,
and challenge the unchallengeable.

In article <v0nrka$1m0et$3@dont-email.me>, Dawn.Belle.Flood@gmail.com
says...
>
> On 4/28/2024 11:38 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
> > The Starmaker wrote:
> >>
> >> Atheism is a belief, it's not a science.
> >
> > Religious beliefs and Atheism beliefs are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
> >
> >
> > Atheist are confident that there is no God, as Religions are confident that there is a God.
> >
> >
> >
> > They are are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
> >
>
> No atheist thinks this way. Have your read Professor Richard Dawkins'
> The God Delusion?
>
> Dawn

If all you read is negative by atheists then your mind can not grasp the
possibility.

You could make the same claim about all of the religions of this world. Why do you think they call it "faith"?

On 04/29/2024 09:02 AM, palsing wrote:
> You could make the same claim about all of the religions of this world.
> Why do you think they call it "faith"?

In my podcasts I talk about "cyclic metaphysic",
which is a very brief metaphysics, and doesn't
care or is agnostic both deism and a-deism,
or theism and a-theism, where of course it's
unfalsifiable either way and "super-scientific".

There is though sort of arrived at why there
_is_ a brief metaphysics for a teleology as
after Kant's "Sublime" and Hegel's Kant's "Sublime",
making for a "strong" mathematical platonism,
and also, a "stronger" logicism and positivism.

"Faith" is for "Truth", "faith in the belief in
the" and "belief in the faith in the", truth.

This isn't necessarily very "20'th century"
yet it is very "21'st century" a sort of
"Greatest Hits of All Time".

It's scholastic and an apologetics.

A brief metaphysics for a strong mathematical platonism
and a stronger logicism and positivism is arrived at.

Of course, it's scientific.

On Sun, 28 Apr 2024 21:38:00 -0700, The Starmaker
<starmaker@ix.netcom.com> wrote:

>The Starmaker wrote:
>>
>> Atheism is a belief, it's not a science.
>
>Religious beliefs and Atheism beliefs are both on the same level of ...beliefs.

Nope. Atheism is a lack of belief in the existence of a god.
>
>
>Atheist are confident that there is no God, ...

That's a strawman. Not believing in the existence of a god is not the
same as a belief in the non-existence of a god.

> ... as Religions are confident that there is a God.

"Religions" are not confident that there is a god. The followers are.
Anyway...
>
>
>
>They are are both on the same level of ...beliefs.

Without claiming knowledge, I would say that I believe there are no
gods. But the difference between my belief and the theist's belief is
that I can be proven wrong, whereas the theist can't. And that is the
fundamental difference between the two kinds of belief.

--
Malte Runz

On Sun, 28 Apr 2024 21:38:00 -0700, The Starmaker
<starmaker@ix.netcom.com> in alt.atheism with message-id
<662F2428.72E6@ix.netcom.com> wrote:

>The Starmaker wrote:
>>
>> Atheism is a belief, it's not a science.
>
>Religious beliefs and Atheism beliefs are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
>
>
>Atheist are confident that there is no God, as Religions are confident that there is a God.
>
>
>
>They are are both on the same level of ...beliefs.

Not really. Theists postulate the existence of something
without any supporting evidence for that existence. Atheists
say without supporting evidence there is no reason to accept
the existence of anything. Including any god.

Using the logic of theists the existence of anything at all
can be supported, including werewolves, trolls, elves,
vampires, dragons, shape changers, and people with super
hero abilities.

Absence of proof that something exists does not suggest that
it does exist.

Some of the Republican positions I find disgusting
and abhorrent.
Most of the Democratic positions I find terrifying.

Whatever it takes - Stop the Democrats. Or the Dims
as I prefer to call them

The most dangerous enemies the United States has:

Biden the Senile Bastard and his Bitch and
supported by the Sluts and Pimps including
Ilhan Omar, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez,
Ayanna Pressley, Rashida Tlaib, Jamaal Bowman,
Cori Bush, Adam Schiff, Maxine Waters, Jerry Nadler,
Chuck Schumer, Nancy Pelosi and Cory Booker. They
have stepped over the line and are working against
the country and what it stands for.

Do not work with them but oppose everything they attempt.

Stop the Green Raw Deal! I dare call it treason.
Go WOKE. Go broke.
CRT - Criminals Recruiting Thugs
DEI - Dumbass Egotistical Idiocy
End all social engineering programs.

I don't know how Comical Karine can still hold a straight
face with what she has to say.

Did the last sane person leaving California remember to
turn off the lights? Did he do the same for the Rotten
Apple?

Abortion should be like any other medical procedure
and be the decision of the patient and the doctor.
It is the business of no one else.

There is only one reason for a woman to get an abortion.
She want's it. All else is irrelevant

I support a Pro-Choice Constitutional Amendment.

Don't build a wall, build a kill zone.

On 30/04/2024 3:36 am, Malte Runz wrote:
> On Sun, 28 Apr 2024 21:38:00 -0700, The Starmaker
> <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>
>> The Starmaker wrote:
>>>
>>> Atheism is a belief, it's not a science.
>>
>> Religious beliefs and Atheism beliefs are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
>
> Nope. Atheism is a lack of belief in the existence of a god.

Sheesh, these people really are morons!

That is what you believe!!!

Michael Christ

>>
>>
>> Atheist are confident that there is no God, ...
>
> That's a strawman. Not believing in the existence of a god is not the
> same as a belief in the non-existence of a god.
>
>> ... as Religions are confident that there is a God.
>
>
> "Religions" are not confident that there is a god. The followers are.
> Anyway...
>>
>>
>>
>> They are are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
>
> Without claiming knowledge, I would say that I believe there are no
> gods. But the difference between my belief and the theist's belief is
> that I can be proven wrong, whereas the theist can't. And that is the
> fundamental difference between the two kinds of belief.
>

--
God is God in all His Being.

Jesus is the everlasting Father, Jesus is God, Jesus is the Lord. John
10:30  I and Father are one. If you can't see that the Lord Jesus is the
everlasting Father you are not born again and can't see the Kingdom of God.

Colossians 2:9 For in him dwelleth all the fulness of the Godhead bodily.

Rom 5:8 But God commendeth his love toward us, in that, while we were
YET sinners, Christ died for us.

Jeremiah 10:23 O LORD, I know that the way of man is not in himself: it
is not in man that walketh to direct his steps.

Psalms 53:1 The fool hath said in his heart, There is no God. Corrupt
are they, and have done abominable iniquity: there is none that doeth good.

Proverbs 12:15 The way of a fool is right in his own eyes: but he that
hearkeneth unto counsel is wise.

"To seek your own will is to seek your own glory."

"If God is not first in everything He is not first in anything."

"What makes the bible the truth? The resonance (voice, the Person) of
God. When you find Him you have found the author."

"All men were born sinners. Why? Because all men were born not loving
God with all their heart, soul, and mind. An abomination. Therefore,
sin is not what you do; it is what you are."

"Compromise will condemn you."

"There are no sinners in Christ Jesus."

"My sons are born of Me. In them is no darkness at all."

"You can't learn righteousness. Haven't you had enough time already to
know that?"

"The way of truth is the testimony of life."

"I merely speak the truth, what is revealed to me, and the cards fall
where God intends."

"Nothing that is produced is produced without first being faith."

"You can only find proof of God through faith because that is how we all
live, by faith."

"It is not what you do that matters, it is how you treat Me."

"Keep going forward. Forget about the past. Lift up your head, look
ahead."

"You cannot be free and free indeed with guilt in your heart."

"Priority is everything."

"The truth doesn't need evidence, it is evidence."

"There is no greater possession a man has than his own will, to squander
it or to place it where it truly belongs."

"An atheist is a fool who thinks truth is found in living a lie."

"Saying "prove it" [as a foundation] is merely an ignorant straw man, to
an ignorant straw man."

"Wait, rest, be still, and know."

"No man can wash his own hands!!!"

"I find this in the Christianity religions: 'Nobody's perfect' they say,
and they use that as an excuse not to do what is perfect."

The Atheist: "They don't believe and put their faith in a Creator (the
obvious). So no evidence and proof is to be found!!"

"The world is the way it is because God can't compromise who He is."

"Man is not the centre of being."

"Man is incompatible with the natural world because of his sinful nature."

"And then the Lord said, "I see everything."

"Man has no greater idol than his own will."

"Where is God hiding? He isn't."

"If you don't keep all the scriptures, you can't keep any of them."

"You can't prove anything because everything depends on a person's
willingness to believe."

"Atheists are ultimately trying to be pointlessness, meaninglessness,
and purposelessness in their point, meaning, and purpose."

"The last day of creation will be the last day of time. God is always
full of hope."

"The veil of the temple was rent in twain, not to have a book pass
through it so that a sinner could play God."

"A phylactery does not a heart for God make. Not back then, and not today."

"No one in heaven is better (or higher) than what makes it heaven. Such
is the love of God."

"The definition of an atheist: A man full of bluster and bullshit
pretending he is the meaning of life."

"Free will is not power; it is the choice that I allow; that choice is
still according to my power," says the Lord.

What does a fool do? A fool looks for a "nothing" in a "something" in
order to explain the existence of existence.

"Unless you do all because He is who He is, all your religion is in vain."

"Every man is subject to God; He judges every man, and He is reality.
 What a gift in a fallen world!"

"Love MUST be a choice or it is nothing but a law!"

"Why were all men born sinners? So that God could reveal Himself, so
that we would behold the glory of God, and that we should bring forth
the glory of God"

"God does not and will not arbitrate for any man to love Him! If God
isn't everything to you, He is nothing to you where the rubber meets the
road."

"It is the unforgivable sin not to love God with all your heart, soul,
and mind. What do you have that is lasting? It is not so much being
punished; it is what you are left with."

"Love isn't worth anything without first a free will choice for God to
birth it in a man."

"The point of salvation: desperation. Anything less than that is
self-righteousness."

"A sinner is not a believer in God; a sinner is a believer in sin."

"A piece of dirt is not the promised land; that is only a reflection.
The promised land is knowing Me, says the Lord."

"It is all about God or it is all about idolatry."

"The Lord Jesus is coming soon. He has always come soon."

"There is no revolving door of self-worship in a son of God's life!"

"There is no such thing as random!"

"You can't truly love without it being with all your heart."

"No one can see God without their whole heart. Unless you can see God,
you know nothing."

"You can't learn God, God has to reveal Himself to you."

"No sinner is sinless in any way."

"Only God is life; only the Kingdom of God of His "Nature" is life."

"What you believe is just a leaning on your own understanding; faith is
a leaning on the one you have chosen to trust."

"God uses the "letter" to crucify a man and raise him from the dead."

"Not fearing God is sheer stupidity for sinners."

"Self-righteousness is any exclusion of God in your heart, because any
exclusion reveals that you think more about yourself than what you
really are."

Malte Runz wrote:
> On Sun, 28 Apr 2024 21:38:00 -0700, The Starmaker
> <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>
>> The Starmaker wrote:
>>> Atheism is a belief, it's not a science.
>> Religious beliefs and Atheism beliefs are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
> Nope. Atheism is a lack of belief in the existence of a god.

IOW a belief that God or any specific gods don't exist

>>
>> Atheist are confident that there is no God, ...
> That's a strawman. Not believing in the existence of a god is not the
> same as a belief in the non-existence of a god.

why?

>
>> ... as Religions are confident that there is a God.
>
> "Religions" are not confident that there is a god. The followers are.
> Anyway...
>>
>>
>> They are are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
> Without claiming knowledge, I would say that I believe there are no
> gods. But the difference between my belief and the theist's belief is
> that I can be proven wrong, whereas the theist can't. And that is the
> fundamental difference between the two kinds of belief.
>

yes

--
“Atheism is the birth right of all human, remember that!”- hhyapster 7.4.23

"Christian beliefs fail against reason, facts, and knowledge"

"Religion is not about truth, it's about lifestyle"

"God is a convenient explanation for what man does not understand.
The less that's inexplicable, the less need for a 'God' explanation."

"The problem with theism is that it never remains within
the realm of belief, but invariably proceeds to assertion"

Attila wrote:
> On Sun, 28 Apr 2024 21:38:00 -0700, The Starmaker
> <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> in alt.atheism with message-id
> <662F2428.72E6@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>
>> The Starmaker wrote:
>>> Atheism is a belief, it's not a science.
>> Religious beliefs and Atheism beliefs are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
>>
>>
>> Atheist are confident that there is no God, as Religions are confident that there is a God.
>>
>>
>>
>> They are are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
>
> Not really. Theists postulate the existence of something
> without any supporting evidence for that existence.

I disagree. billions of believers and personal testimony is evidence.

> Atheists
> say without supporting evidence there is no reason to accept
> the existence of anything. Including any god.
>
> Using the logic of theists the existence of anything at all
> can be supported, including werewolves, trolls, elves,
> vampires, dragons, shape changers, and people with super
> hero abilities.
>
> Absence of proof that something exists does not suggest that
> it does exist.
>
> Some of the Republican positions I find disgusting
> and abhorrent.
> Most of the Democratic positions I find terrifying.
>
> Whatever it takes - Stop the Democrats. Or the Dims
> as I prefer to call them
>
> The most dangerous enemies the United States has:
>
> Biden the Senile Bastard and his Bitch and
> supported by the Sluts and Pimps including
> Ilhan Omar, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez,
> Ayanna Pressley, Rashida Tlaib, Jamaal Bowman,
> Cori Bush, Adam Schiff, Maxine Waters, Jerry Nadler,
> Chuck Schumer, Nancy Pelosi and Cory Booker. They
> have stepped over the line and are working against
> the country and what it stands for.
>
> Do not work with them but oppose everything they attempt.
>
> Stop the Green Raw Deal! I dare call it treason.
> Go WOKE. Go broke.
> CRT - Criminals Recruiting Thugs
> DEI - Dumbass Egotistical Idiocy
> End all social engineering programs.
>
> I don't know how Comical Karine can still hold a straight
> face with what she has to say.
>
> Did the last sane person leaving California remember to
> turn off the lights? Did he do the same for the Rotten
> Apple?
>
> Abortion should be like any other medical procedure
> and be the decision of the patient and the doctor.
> It is the business of no one else.
>
> There is only one reason for a woman to get an abortion.
> She want's it. All else is irrelevant
>
> I support a Pro-Choice Constitutional Amendment.
>
> Don't build a wall, build a kill zone.

--
“Atheism is the birth right of all human, remember that!”- hhyapster 7.4.23

"Christian beliefs fail against reason, facts, and knowledge"

"Religion is not about truth, it's about lifestyle"

"God is a convenient explanation for what man does not understand.
The less that's inexplicable, the less need for a 'God' explanation."

"The problem with theism is that it never remains within
the realm of belief, but invariably proceeds to assertion"

On Tue, 30 Apr 2024 11:59:25 +1000, Maximus
<gladiator@colosseum.rome> in alt.atheism with message-id
<l9b1k0FniudU1@mid.individual.net> wrote:

>Attila wrote:
>> On Sun, 28 Apr 2024 21:38:00 -0700, The Starmaker
>> <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> in alt.atheism with message-id
>> <662F2428.72E6@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>>
>>> The Starmaker wrote:
>>>> Atheism is a belief, it's not a science.
>>> Religious beliefs and Atheism beliefs are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
>>>
>>>
>>> Atheist are confident that there is no God, as Religions are confident that there is a God.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> They are are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
>>
>> Not really. Theists postulate the existence of something
>> without any supporting evidence for that existence.
>
>I disagree. billions of believers and personal testimony is evidence.

Personal testimony is never evidence since there is no way
to support it. As far as the "belief of billions" is
concerned there are hundreds of different beliefs in there
and they can't all be correct.

History is full of examples of huge numbers of people being
incorrect about many things. Supporting evidence is
lacking.

Some of the Republican positions I find disgusting
and abhorrent.
Most of the Democratic positions I find terrifying.

Whatever it takes - Stop the Democrats. Or the Dims
as I prefer to call them

The most dangerous enemies the United States has:

Biden the Senile Bastard and his Bitch and
supported by the Sluts and Pimps including
Ilhan Omar, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez,
Ayanna Pressley, Rashida Tlaib, Jamaal Bowman,
Cori Bush, Adam Schiff, Maxine Waters, Jerry Nadler,
Chuck Schumer, Nancy Pelosi and Cory Booker. They
have stepped over the line and are working against
the country and what it stands for.

Do not work with them but oppose everything they attempt.

Stop the Green Raw Deal! I dare call it treason.
Go WOKE. Go broke.
CRT - Criminals Recruiting Thugs
DEI - Dumbass Egotistical Idiocy
End all social engineering programs.

I don't know how Comical Karine can still hold a straight
face with what she has to say.

Did the last sane person leaving California remember to
turn off the lights? Did he do the same for the Rotten
Apple?

Abortion should be like any other medical procedure
and be the decision of the patient and the doctor.
It is the business of no one else.

There is only one reason for a woman to get an abortion.
She want's it. All else is irrelevant

I support a Pro-Choice Constitutional Amendment.

Don't build a wall, build a kill zone.

Attila wrote:
> On Tue, 30 Apr 2024 11:59:25 +1000, Maximus
> <gladiator@colosseum.rome> in alt.atheism with message-id
> <l9b1k0FniudU1@mid.individual.net> wrote:
>
>> Attila wrote:
>>> On Sun, 28 Apr 2024 21:38:00 -0700, The Starmaker
>>> <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> in alt.atheism with message-id
>>> <662F2428.72E6@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> The Starmaker wrote:
>>>>> Atheism is a belief, it's not a science.
>>>> Religious beliefs and Atheism beliefs are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Atheist are confident that there is no God, as Religions are confident that there is a God.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> They are are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
>>> Not really. Theists postulate the existence of something
>>> without any supporting evidence for that existence.
>> I disagree. billions of believers and personal testimony is evidence.
> Personal testimony is never evidence

any court would disagree with you

> since there is no way
> to support it.
> As far as the "belief of billions" is
> concerned there are hundreds of different beliefs in there
> and they can't all be correct.

I was referring to Xtianity and Islam primarily

>
> History is full of examples of huge numbers of people being
> incorrect about many things. Supporting evidence is
> lacking.
>
> Some of the Republican positions I find disgusting
> and abhorrent.
> Most of the Democratic positions I find terrifying.
>
> Whatever it takes - Stop the Democrats. Or the Dims
> as I prefer to call them
>
> The most dangerous enemies the United States has:
>
> Biden the Senile Bastard and his Bitch and
> supported by the Sluts and Pimps including
> Ilhan Omar, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez,
> Ayanna Pressley, Rashida Tlaib, Jamaal Bowman,
> Cori Bush, Adam Schiff, Maxine Waters, Jerry Nadler,
> Chuck Schumer, Nancy Pelosi and Cory Booker. They
> have stepped over the line and are working against
> the country and what it stands for.
>
> Do not work with them but oppose everything they attempt.
>
> Stop the Green Raw Deal! I dare call it treason.
> Go WOKE. Go broke.
> CRT - Criminals Recruiting Thugs
> DEI - Dumbass Egotistical Idiocy
> End all social engineering programs.
>
> I don't know how Comical Karine can still hold a straight
> face with what she has to say.
>
> Did the last sane person leaving California remember to
> turn off the lights? Did he do the same for the Rotten
> Apple?
>
> Abortion should be like any other medical procedure
> and be the decision of the patient and the doctor.
> It is the business of no one else.
>
> There is only one reason for a woman to get an abortion.
> She want's it. All else is irrelevant
>
> I support a Pro-Choice Constitutional Amendment.
>
> Don't build a wall, build a kill zone.

--
“Atheism is the birth right of all human, remember that!”- hhyapster 7.4.23

"Christian beliefs fail against reason, facts, and knowledge"

"Religion is not about truth, it's about lifestyle"

"God is a convenient explanation for what man does not understand.
The less that's inexplicable, the less need for a 'God' explanation."

"The problem with theism is that it never remains within
the realm of belief, but invariably proceeds to assertion"

On Tue, 30 Apr 2024, Maximus wrote:

> Attila wrote:
>> On Sun, 28 Apr 2024 21:38:00 -0700, The Starmaker
>> <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> in alt.atheism with message-id
>> <662F2428.72E6@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>>
>>> The Starmaker wrote:
>>>> Atheism is a belief, it's not a science.
>>> Religious beliefs and Atheism beliefs are both on the same level of
>>> ...beliefs.
>>>
>>>
>>> Atheist are confident that there is no God, as Religions are confident
>>> that there is a God.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> They are are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
>>
>> Not really. Theists postulate the existence of something
>> without any supporting evidence for that existence.
>
> I disagree. billions of believers and personal testimony is evidence.

That is not scientific proof. In order to count as proof, they need to
devise a test that proves god. No such test has ever been devised that
satisfies the rigorous standards of science.

If personal testimony would be enough, then you end up with a pantheon of
gods, pink unicorns, ufos etc. I am sure you can see how foolish this
position is.

If you have a scientific proof, let's hear it, and I'm sure that this
group would be converted.

Now... here's the kicker. Any god that would be possible to prove with
science, would not be a god, but a component of this world.

So by the very nature of us, the world we live in and our senses, a god
that is per definition, outside this world, is impossible to prove.

That hasn't stopped people from trying, but that is why you will never
convince anyone here. I'm sure you know that and that this is just light
entertainment, but I'll mention it anyway.

>> Atheists
>> say without supporting evidence there is no reason to accept
>> the existence of anything. Including any god.
>>
>> Using the logic of theists the existence of anything at all
>> can be supported, including werewolves, trolls, elves,
>> vampires, dragons, shape changers, and people with super
>> hero abilities.
>>
>> Absence of proof that something exists does not suggest that
>> it does exist.
>>
>> Some of the Republican positions I find disgusting
>> and abhorrent.
>> Most of the Democratic positions I find terrifying.
>>
>> Whatever it takes - Stop the Democrats. Or the Dims
>> as I prefer to call them
>>
>> The most dangerous enemies the United States has:
>>
>> Biden the Senile Bastard and his Bitch and
>> supported by the Sluts and Pimps including
>> Ilhan Omar, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez,
>> Ayanna Pressley, Rashida Tlaib, Jamaal Bowman,
>> Cori Bush, Adam Schiff, Maxine Waters, Jerry Nadler,
>> Chuck Schumer, Nancy Pelosi and Cory Booker. They
>> have stepped over the line and are working against
>> the country and what it stands for.
>>
>> Do not work with them but oppose everything they attempt.
>>
>> Stop the Green Raw Deal! I dare call it treason.
>> Go WOKE. Go broke.
>> CRT - Criminals Recruiting Thugs
>> DEI - Dumbass Egotistical Idiocy
>> End all social engineering programs.
>>
>> I don't know how Comical Karine can still hold a straight
>> face with what she has to say.
>>
>> Did the last sane person leaving California remember to
>> turn off the lights? Did he do the same for the Rotten
>> Apple?
>>
>> Abortion should be like any other medical procedure
>> and be the decision of the patient and the doctor.
>> It is the business of no one else.
>>
>> There is only one reason for a woman to get an abortion.
>> She want's it. All else is irrelevant
>>
>> I support a Pro-Choice Constitutional Amendment.
>>
>> Don't build a wall, build a kill zone.
>
>
>

D wrote:
>
>
> On Tue, 30 Apr 2024, Maximus wrote:
>
>> Attila wrote:
>>> On Sun, 28 Apr 2024 21:38:00 -0700, The Starmaker
>>> <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> in alt.atheism with message-id
>>> <662F2428.72E6@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>> The Starmaker wrote:
>>>>> Atheism is a belief, it's not a science.
>>>> Religious beliefs and Atheism beliefs are both on the same level of
>>>> ...beliefs.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Atheist are confident that there is no God, as Religions are
>>>> confident that there is a God.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> They are are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
>>>
>>> Not really.  Theists postulate the existence of something
>>> without any supporting evidence for that existence.
>>
>> I disagree. billions of believers and personal testimony is evidence.
>
> That is not scientific proof.

I never said it was

> In order to count as proof, they need to devise a test that proves
> god. No such test has ever been devised that satisfies the rigorous
> standards of science.
>
> If personal testimony would be enough, then you end up with a pantheon
> of gods, pink unicorns, ufos etc. I am sure you can see how foolish
> this position is.

with any evidence, we must determine credibility. there are currently
2.4 billion christians and almost 2 billion muslims in the world today.
believers in pink unicorns, or other gods, don't even come close.

>
> If you have a scientific proof, let's hear it, and I'm sure that this
> group would be converted.
>
> Now... here's the kicker. Any god that would be possible to prove with
> science, would not be a god, but a component of this world.
>
> So by the very nature of us, the world we live in and our senses, a
> god that is per definition, outside this world, is impossible to prove.
>
> That hasn't stopped people from trying, but that is why you will never
> convince anyone here. I'm sure you know that and that this is just
> light entertainment, but I'll mention it anyway.
>
>>> Atheists
>>> say without supporting evidence there is no reason to accept
>>> the existence of anything.  Including any god.
>>>
>>> Using the logic of theists the existence of anything at all
>>> can be supported, including werewolves, trolls, elves,
>>> vampires, dragons, shape changers, and people with super
>>> hero abilities.
>>>
>>> Absence of proof that something exists does not suggest that
>>> it does exist.
>>>
>>>

--
“Atheism is the birth right of all human, remember that!”- hhyapster 7.4.23

"Christian beliefs fail against reason, facts, and knowledge"

"Religion is not about truth, it's about lifestyle"

"God is a convenient explanation for what man does not understand.
The less that's inexplicable, the less need for a 'God' explanation."

"The problem with theism is that it never remains within
the realm of belief, but invariably proceeds to assertion"

On Tue, 30 Apr 2024 18:18:28 +1000, Maximus
<gladiator@colosseum.rome> in alt.atheism with message-id
<l9bnqmFqncgU1@mid.individual.net> wrote:

>Attila wrote:
>> On Tue, 30 Apr 2024 11:59:25 +1000, Maximus
>> <gladiator@colosseum.rome> in alt.atheism with message-id
>> <l9b1k0FniudU1@mid.individual.net> wrote:
>>
>>> Attila wrote:
>>>> On Sun, 28 Apr 2024 21:38:00 -0700, The Starmaker
>>>> <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> in alt.atheism with message-id
>>>> <662F2428.72E6@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> The Starmaker wrote:
>>>>>> Atheism is a belief, it's not a science.
>>>>> Religious beliefs and Atheism beliefs are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Atheist are confident that there is no God, as Religions are confident that there is a God.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> They are are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
>>>> Not really. Theists postulate the existence of something
>>>> without any supporting evidence for that existence.
>>> I disagree. billions of believers and personal testimony is evidence.
>> Personal testimony is never evidence
>
>any court would disagree with you

It is well known that personal testimony is the poorest kind
of evidence.

The value of eyewitnesses:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJG698U2Mvo

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubNF9QNEQLA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ahg6qcgoay4

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bnnmWYI0lM

>
>> since there is no way
>> to support it.
>> As far as the "belief of billions" is
>> concerned there are hundreds of different beliefs in there
>> and they can't all be correct.
>
>I was referring to Xtianity and Islam primarily

How about Hindu? There are hundreds of others. In fact
there are many, many different Christian beliefs.

>
>>
>> History is full of examples of huge numbers of people being
>> incorrect about many things. Supporting evidence is
>> lacking.
>>

--

Some of the Republican positions I find disgusting
and abhorrent.
Most of the Democratic positions I find terrifying.

Whatever it takes - Stop the Democrats. Or the Dims
as I prefer to call them

The most dangerous enemies the United States has:

Biden the Senile Bastard and his Bitch and
supported by the Sluts and Pimps including
Ilhan Omar, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez,
Ayanna Pressley, Rashida Tlaib, Jamaal Bowman,
Cori Bush, Adam Schiff, Maxine Waters, Jerry Nadler,
Chuck Schumer, Nancy Pelosi and Cory Booker. They
have stepped over the line and are working against
the country and what it stands for.

Do not work with them but oppose everything they attempt.

Stop the Green Raw Deal! I dare call it treason.
Go WOKE. Go broke.
CRT - Criminals Recruiting Thugs
DEI - Dumbass Egotistical Idiocy
End all social engineering programs.

I don't know how Comical Karine can still hold a straight
face with what she has to say.

Did the last sane person leaving California remember to
turn off the lights? Did he do the same for the Rotten
Apple?

Abortion should be like any other medical procedure
and be the decision of the patient and the doctor.
It is the business of no one else.

There is only one reason for a woman to get an abortion.
She want's it. All else is irrelevant

I support a Pro-Choice Constitutional Amendment.

Don't build a wall, build a kill zone.

On Tue, 30 Apr 2024 19:39:27 +1000, Maximus
<gladiator@colosseum.rome> in alt.atheism with message-id
<l9bsiiFrec7U1@mid.individual.net> wrote:

>D wrote:
>>
>>
>> On Tue, 30 Apr 2024, Maximus wrote:
>>
>>> Attila wrote:
>>>> On Sun, 28 Apr 2024 21:38:00 -0700, The Starmaker
>>>> <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> in alt.atheism with message-id
>>>> <662F2428.72E6@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> The Starmaker wrote:
>>>>>> Atheism is a belief, it's not a science.
>>>>> Religious beliefs and Atheism beliefs are both on the same level of
>>>>> ...beliefs.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Atheist are confident that there is no God, as Religions are
>>>>> confident that there is a God.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> They are are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
>>>>
>>>> Not really.  Theists postulate the existence of something
>>>> without any supporting evidence for that existence.
>>>
>>> I disagree. billions of believers and personal testimony is evidence.
>>
>> That is not scientific proof.
>
>I never said it was
>
>> In order to count as proof, they need to devise a test that proves
>> god. No such test has ever been devised that satisfies the rigorous
>> standards of science.
>>
>> If personal testimony would be enough, then you end up with a pantheon
>> of gods, pink unicorns, ufos etc. I am sure you can see how foolish
>> this position is.
>
>with any evidence, we must determine credibility. there are currently
>2.4 billion christians and almost 2 billion muslims in the world today.
>believers in pink unicorns, or other gods, don't even come close.

Interesting. At some point there were less than 20 persons
who believed in Christianity and millions that believed in
other gods. Does that mean those gods were valid at that
time and Christianity was not? Does a religion become
valid when a certain level of belief is reached? What is
the number needed to validate a religion as being true?

Are you say the numbers prove both Christians and Muslims
are valid so there are at least two gods? Do Hindus
contribute a third?

>
>>
>> If you have a scientific proof, let's hear it, and I'm sure that this
>> group would be converted.
>>
>> Now... here's the kicker. Any god that would be possible to prove with
>> science, would not be a god, but a component of this world.
>>
>> So by the very nature of us, the world we live in and our senses, a
>> god that is per definition, outside this world, is impossible to prove.
>>
>> That hasn't stopped people from trying, but that is why you will never
>> convince anyone here. I'm sure you know that and that this is just
>> light entertainment, but I'll mention it anyway.
>>
>>>> Atheists
>>>> say without supporting evidence there is no reason to accept
>>>> the existence of anything.  Including any god.
>>>>
>>>> Using the logic of theists the existence of anything at all
>>>> can be supported, including werewolves, trolls, elves,
>>>> vampires, dragons, shape changers, and people with super
>>>> hero abilities.
>>>>
>>>> Absence of proof that something exists does not suggest that
>>>> it does exist.
>>>>
>>>>

--

Some of the Republican positions I find disgusting
and abhorrent.
Most of the Democratic positions I find terrifying.

Whatever it takes - Stop the Democrats. Or the Dims
as I prefer to call them

The most dangerous enemies the United States has:

Biden the Senile Bastard and his Bitch and
supported by the Sluts and Pimps including
Ilhan Omar, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez,
Ayanna Pressley, Rashida Tlaib, Jamaal Bowman,
Cori Bush, Adam Schiff, Maxine Waters, Jerry Nadler,
Chuck Schumer, Nancy Pelosi and Cory Booker. They
have stepped over the line and are working against
the country and what it stands for.

Do not work with them but oppose everything they attempt.

Stop the Green Raw Deal! I dare call it treason.
Go WOKE. Go broke.
CRT - Criminals Recruiting Thugs
DEI - Dumbass Egotistical Idiocy
End all social engineering programs.

I don't know how Comical Karine can still hold a straight
face with what she has to say.

Did the last sane person leaving California remember to
turn off the lights? Did he do the same for the Rotten
Apple?

Abortion should be like any other medical procedure
and be the decision of the patient and the doctor.
It is the business of no one else.

There is only one reason for a woman to get an abortion.
She want's it. All else is irrelevant

I support a Pro-Choice Constitutional Amendment.

Don't build a wall, build a kill zone.

On 4/29/2024 10:46 AM, Skeeter wrote:
> In article <v0nrka$1m0et$3@dont-email.me>, Dawn.Belle.Flood@gmail.com
> says...
>>
>> On 4/28/2024 11:38 PM, The Starmaker wrote:
>>> The Starmaker wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Atheism is a belief, it's not a science.
>>>
>>> Religious beliefs and Atheism beliefs are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
>>>
>>>
>>> Atheist are confident that there is no God, as Religions are confident that there is a God.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> They are are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
>>>
>>
>> No atheist thinks this way. Have your read Professor Richard Dawkins'
>> The God Delusion?
>>
>> Dawn
>
> If all you read is negative by atheists then your mind can not grasp the
> possibility.

I'm delighted to read anything by anyone, religious or not, and for that
matter, on any topic espousing any position. Of course, there is only
so much time in any given day.

Dawn

Attila wrote:
> On Tue, 30 Apr 2024 18:18:28 +1000, Maximus
> <gladiator@colosseum.rome> in alt.atheism with message-id
> <l9bnqmFqncgU1@mid.individual.net> wrote:
>
>> Attila wrote:
>>> On Tue, 30 Apr 2024 11:59:25 +1000, Maximus
>>> <gladiator@colosseum.rome> in alt.atheism with message-id
>>> <l9b1k0FniudU1@mid.individual.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Attila wrote:
>>>>> On Sun, 28 Apr 2024 21:38:00 -0700, The Starmaker
>>>>> <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> in alt.atheism with message-id
>>>>> <662F2428.72E6@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> The Starmaker wrote:
>>>>>>> Atheism is a belief, it's not a science.
>>>>>> Religious beliefs and Atheism beliefs are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Atheist are confident that there is no God, as Religions are confident that there is a God.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> They are are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
>>>>> Not really. Theists postulate the existence of something
>>>>> without any supporting evidence for that existence.
>>>> I disagree. billions of believers and personal testimony is evidence.
>>> Personal testimony is never evidence
>> any court would disagree with you
> It is well known that personal testimony is the poorest kind
> of evidence.

maybe, but still evidence. and it's relative to numbers. if twenty pp
say they saw me run down a pedestrian in my car, that carries more
weight than if just one person says it.

>
> The value of eyewitnesses:
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJG698U2Mvo
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubNF9QNEQLA
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ahg6qcgoay4
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bnnmWYI0lM

I'm not going to watch all those, sorry. (see comment below)

>
>>> since there is no way
>>> to support it.
>>> As far as the "belief of billions" is
>>> concerned there are hundreds of different beliefs in there
>>> and they can't all be correct.
>> I was referring to Xtianity and Islam primarily
> How about Hindu?

about 1.2 billion. but Christians and Islamists make up over 50% of all
religious faiths.

> There are hundreds of others. In fact
> there are many, many different Christian beliefs.

yes. I'm just saying it's not as you say that there's no evidence. for
example believers spend a lot of money in support of their faith. just
near where I am there's a 7th day Adventist complex worth many millions
of dollars. also many intelligent ppl have religious beliefs. in fact
theists vastly outnumber us. you can't just dismiss such things as being
no evidence that there may be some validity to their beliefs. but at the
end of the day, I look at what the beliefs actually are. when one does
that, it's not so difficult to dismiss them as nonsense. eg. xtians
believe they will live in mansions, and walk on streets paved with gold
in some god adoring afterlife, and muslims believe they will get 70
virgins if they die as martyrs.

--
“Atheism is the birth right of all human, remember that!”- hhyapster 7.4.23

"Christian beliefs fail against reason, facts, and knowledge"

"Religion is not about truth, it's about lifestyle"

"God is a convenient explanation for what man does not understand.
The less that's inexplicable, the less need for a 'God' explanation."

"The problem with theism is that it never remains within
the realm of belief, but invariably proceeds to assertion"

Attila wrote:
> On Tue, 30 Apr 2024 19:39:27 +1000, Maximus
> <gladiator@colosseum.rome> in alt.atheism with message-id
> <l9bsiiFrec7U1@mid.individual.net> wrote:
>
>> D wrote:
>>>
>>> On Tue, 30 Apr 2024, Maximus wrote:
>>>
>>>> Attila wrote:
>>>>> On Sun, 28 Apr 2024 21:38:00 -0700, The Starmaker
>>>>> <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> in alt.atheism with message-id
>>>>> <662F2428.72E6@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> The Starmaker wrote:
>>>>>>> Atheism is a belief, it's not a science.
>>>>>> Religious beliefs and Atheism beliefs are both on the same level of
>>>>>> ...beliefs.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Atheist are confident that there is no God, as Religions are
>>>>>> confident that there is a God.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> They are are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
>>>>> Not really.  Theists postulate the existence of something
>>>>> without any supporting evidence for that existence.
>>>> I disagree. billions of believers and personal testimony is evidence.
>>> That is not scientific proof.
>> I never said it was
>>
>>> In order to count as proof, they need to devise a test that proves
>>> god. No such test has ever been devised that satisfies the rigorous
>>> standards of science.
>>>
>>> If personal testimony would be enough, then you end up with a pantheon
>>> of gods, pink unicorns, ufos etc. I am sure you can see how foolish
>>> this position is.
>> with any evidence, we must determine credibility. there are currently
>> 2.4 billion christians and almost 2 billion muslims in the world today.
>> believers in pink unicorns, or other gods, don't even come close.
> Interesting. At some point there were less than 20 persons
> who believed in Christianity and millions that believed in
> other gods. Does that mean those gods were valid at that
> time and Christianity was not? Does a religion become
> valid when a certain level of belief is reached? What is
> the number needed to validate a religion as being true?

I don't believe any number can.

>
> Are you say the numbers prove both Christians and Muslims
> are valid so there are at least two gods? Do Hindus
> contribute a third?

no, could be it's just different beliefs about God

--
“Atheism is the birth right of all human, remember that!”- hhyapster 7.4.23

"Christian beliefs fail against reason, facts, and knowledge"

"Religion is not about truth, it's about lifestyle"

"God is a convenient explanation for what man does not understand.
The less that's inexplicable, the less need for a 'God' explanation."

"The problem with theism is that it never remains within
the realm of belief, but invariably proceeds to assertion"

On Tue, 30 Apr 2024 21:43:47 +1000, Maximus
<gladiator@colosseum.rome> in alt.atheism with message-id
<l9c3rjFsglgU1@mid.individual.net> wrote:

>Attila wrote:
>> On Tue, 30 Apr 2024 18:18:28 +1000, Maximus
>> <gladiator@colosseum.rome> in alt.atheism with message-id
>> <l9bnqmFqncgU1@mid.individual.net> wrote:
>>
>>> Attila wrote:
>>>> On Tue, 30 Apr 2024 11:59:25 +1000, Maximus
>>>> <gladiator@colosseum.rome> in alt.atheism with message-id
>>>> <l9b1k0FniudU1@mid.individual.net> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Attila wrote:
>>>>>> On Sun, 28 Apr 2024 21:38:00 -0700, The Starmaker
>>>>>> <starmaker@ix.netcom.com> in alt.atheism with message-id
>>>>>> <662F2428.72E6@ix.netcom.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The Starmaker wrote:
>>>>>>>> Atheism is a belief, it's not a science.
>>>>>>> Religious beliefs and Atheism beliefs are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Atheist are confident that there is no God, as Religions are confident that there is a God.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> They are are both on the same level of ...beliefs.
>>>>>> Not really. Theists postulate the existence of something
>>>>>> without any supporting evidence for that existence.
>>>>> I disagree. billions of believers and personal testimony is evidence.
>>>> Personal testimony is never evidence
>>> any court would disagree with you
>> It is well known that personal testimony is the poorest kind
>> of evidence.
>
>maybe, but still evidence. and it's relative to numbers. if twenty pp
>say they saw me run down a pedestrian in my car, that carries more
>weight than if just one person says it.

I agree - it is evidence. It just isn't very useful
evidence.

>
>>
>> The value of eyewitnesses:
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJG698U2Mvo
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ubNF9QNEQLA
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ahg6qcgoay4
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_bnnmWYI0lM
>
>I'm not going to watch all those, sorry. (see comment below)

Any one will do. They all show what you see may not be
reality.

>
>>
>>>> since there is no way
>>>> to support it.
>>>> As far as the "belief of billions" is
>>>> concerned there are hundreds of different beliefs in there
>>>> and they can't all be correct.
>>> I was referring to Xtianity and Islam primarily
>> How about Hindu?
>
>about 1.2 billion. but Christians and Islamists make up over 50% of all
>religious faiths.

So what? That doesn't mean any of them are valid.

>
>> There are hundreds of others. In fact
>> there are many, many different Christian beliefs.
>
>yes. I'm just saying it's not as you say that there's no evidence. for
>example believers spend a lot of money in support of their faith. just
>near where I am there's a 7th day Adventist complex worth many millions
>of dollars. also many intelligent ppl have religious beliefs. in fact
>theists vastly outnumber us. you can't just dismiss such things as being
>no evidence that there may be some validity to their beliefs.

Or not. There is exactly the same support either way.

>but at the
>end of the day, I look at what the beliefs actually are. when one does
>that, it's not so difficult to dismiss them as nonsense. eg. xtians
>believe they will live in mansions, and walk on streets paved with gold
>in some god adoring afterlife, and muslims believe they will get 70
>virgins if they die as martyrs.

Most religions have common factors - rewards for believers
and painful punishment for non-believers.

Basically there is no actual supporting evidence either way
for anything involving religion. That is why faith was
invented. Faith is belief without evidence - for those who
believe in such.

I do not.

--

Some of the Republican positions I find disgusting
and abhorrent.
Most of the Democratic positions I find terrifying.

Whatever it takes - Stop the Democrats. Or the Dims
as I prefer to call them

The most dangerous enemies the United States has:

Biden the Senile Bastard and his Bitch and
supported by the Sluts and Pimps including
Ilhan Omar, Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez,
Ayanna Pressley, Rashida Tlaib, Jamaal Bowman,
Cori Bush, Adam Schiff, Maxine Waters, Jerry Nadler,
Chuck Schumer, Nancy Pelosi and Cory Booker. They
have stepped over the line and are working against
the country and what it stands for.

Do not work with them but oppose everything they attempt.

Stop the Green Raw Deal! I dare call it treason.
Go WOKE. Go broke.
CRT - Criminals Recruiting Thugs
DEI - Dumbass Egotistical Idiocy
End all social engineering programs.

I don't know how Comical Karine can still hold a straight
face with what she has to say.

Did the last sane person leaving California remember to
turn off the lights? Did he do the same for the Rotten
Apple?

Abortion should be like any other medical procedure
and be the decision of the patient and the doctor.
It is the business of no one else.

There is only one reason for a woman to get an abortion.
She want's it. All else is irrelevant

I support a Pro-Choice Constitutional Amendment.

Don't build a wall, build a kill zone.