Hello!

This is only relevant for those people who read or post in that
newsgroup using Google Groups.

Google will discontinue Groups in 2 days.

For those who do not know Usenet:

Usenet is a distributed communication system consisting of many servers.
Google Groups is only one of them that closes down - other servers will
stay available, but people need to use another server to read and post
here.

There are 2 alternatives:

Using a web-based Usenet interface:
Those behave similar to Google Groups, you can read there, but for
posting you need to register an account for free.

One of them is:
https://www.novabbs.com/interests/thread.php?group=alt.usage.english

Another alternative is to use an NNTP server with a so called
newsreader.

As an NNTP server, some free services exist where you have to register:
https://www.eternal-september.org/
https://solani.org/
https://www.i2pn2.org/
https://news.nntp4.net/

For using it, you need a newsreader.

Some examples are:
https://www.thunderbird.net
https://www.betterbird.eu/
https://claws-mail.org/
https://www.seamonkey-project.org/

You then need to configure a newsgroup account, sometimes also
called NNTP.

For most servers, authentication must be enforced in the newsreader's
settings.

For Thunderbird, a tutorial is available here:
https://www.big-8.org/wiki/Getting_Started_with_Usenet

For questions about configuring those readers, feel free to ask in
the group news.software.readers.

On Tue, 20 Feb 2024 12:07:45 +0100, Marco Moock
<mm+usenet-es@dorfdsl.de> wrote:

>Hello!
>
>This is only relevant for those people who read or post in that
>newsgroup using Google Groups.
>
>Google will discontinue Groups in 2 days.

Thanks -- That looks to be thorough.

I have taken the liberty of copying your message to a couple
of groups that I still check on, though they are next to dead.

I do give you credit. Or, since I did not check out any of the
details, I HOPE that it is only credit and not blame.

--
Rich Ulrich

Marco Moock wrote:

> https://news.nntp4.net/

https://news.nntp4.net/
The user login and registration will be activated on February 22, 2024.

What's wrong with paganini.bofh.team:119 (no login/password necessary)?

Rich Ulrich <rich.ulrich@comcast.net> writes:
>On Tue, 20 Feb 2024 12:07:45 +0100, Marco Moock
><mm+usenet-es@dorfdsl.de> wrote:
>>This is only relevant for those people who read or post in that
>>newsgroup using Google Groups.
>Thanks -- That looks to be thorough.

So, it's ok to refer to the very newsgroup you post in with "that"?

Am 20.02.2024 22:02 Uhr schrieb Indira:

> Marco Moock wrote:
>
> > https://news.nntp4.net/
>
> https://news.nntp4.net/
> The user login and registration will be activated on February 22,
> 2024.

That is new. Other servers offer registration today, see solani.org or
eternal-september.org

> What's wrong with paganini.bofh.team:119 (no login/password
> necessary)?

Ask usenet@bofh.team, maybe it is a filter rule.

--
Gruß
Marco

Spam und Werbung bitte an ichschickereklame@cartoonies.org

On 21/02/24 03:14, Rich Ulrich wrote:
> On Tue, 20 Feb 2024 12:07:45 +0100, Marco Moock
> <mm+usenet-es@dorfdsl.de> wrote:
>
>> Hello!
>>
>> This is only relevant for those people who read or post in that
>> newsgroup using Google Groups.
>>
>> Google will discontinue Groups in 2 days.
>
> Thanks -- That looks to be thorough.
>
> I have taken the liberty of copying your message to a couple of
> groups that I still check on, though they are next to dead.
>
> I do give you credit. Or, since I did not check out any of the
> details, I HOPE that it is only credit and not blame.

It all looked good to me. Marco gave good advice.

I hope it reaches those Respected Regulars who would otherwise disappear.

Unfortunately, it has already reached at least one Unrespected Regular.
But I guess that's a small price to pay. One advantage of moving away
from Google Groups is that you're allowed to use killfiles.

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW

Marco Moock wrote:

>> https://news.nntp4.net/
>> The user login and registration will be activated on February 22,
>> 2024.
>
> That is new. Other servers offer registration today, see solani.org or
> eternal-september.org

I understand. My only point was you can't register. Yet. :->

>> What's wrong with paganini.bofh.team:119 (no login/password
>> necessary)?
>
> Ask usenet@bofh.team, maybe it is a filter rule.

It was my fault for being too direct. Too brief. I will make up for it here
by repeating the point so that it can be made successfully.

You didn't understand, which at first puzzled me, as I was making a
rhetorical question but then I realized you took it literally.

I mean there is nothing wrong with paganini.bofh.team:119, which is the
*simplest* way for a Google Groups Groupie to get into posting because an
account isn't even needed.

All they need with the bastard operators from hell is a newsreader.
Nothing else.

My point was that it's the *simplest* possible solution.
The rhetorical question was asking you why you omitted it.

Sorry for not using English correctly because if I have to explain
then I didn't write it well - or you're not a native English speaker.

Either way, I'll rephrase as:
Q: Why didn't you add Ivo's server into the suggestions?
A: ?

The reason *that* server is the most important is because it's the
simplest, by far - because *no registration* is necessary.

There is the danger that google will decide that it can do more damage
that way and somehow rescind the decision.

But the damage is already done: I can sympathise with PTD's decision to
abstain, because (even before google was preventing him from posting
with the captcha narrative) his articles were being dropped from
eternal-september and its peers who use the same filters. Whats the
point of contributing if there is going to be censorship and your
articles aren't going to be distributed. (nevermind if the censorship is
intended ,on the face of it, or how it is implemented). The "free"
nature of usenet posting had been destroyed. I bet all of the e-s (and
related) users even now only see of Jerry Friedman's postings -- if he
was posting when there was spamming from google spammer were high the
posts got dropped.

The point is the damage to freedom is done, otoh google might as well
declare the project to be a resounding success and withdraw.

Am 21.02.2024 08:03 Uhr schrieb Indira:

> Either way, I'll rephrase as:
> Q: Why didn't you add Ivo's server into the suggestions?
> A: ?

There is no special reason for not listing servers. I could have listed
20.

--
Gruß
Marco

Spam und Werbung bitte an ichschickereklame@cartoonies.org

On 21/02/2024 05:31, Madhu wrote:
>
> There is the danger that google will decide that it can do more damage
> that way and somehow rescind the decision.

Not well phrased, but Google may. (I doubt it.)

>
> But the damage is already done: I can sympathise with PTD's decision to
> abstain,

That's a very kind way of putting it. I'd put PDT's 'abstention' down to
his ineptitude in things technological.

> because (even before google was preventing him from posting
> with the captcha narrative) his articles were being dropped from
> eternal-september and its peers who use the same filters. Whats the
> point of contributing if there is going to be censorship and your
> articles aren't going to be distributed. (nevermind if the censorship is
> intended ,on the face of it, or how it is implemented). The "free"
> nature of usenet posting had been destroyed.

I disagree about 'censorship'. Nothing of the sort. Had PDT been using a
newsreader, he would not have had any problem with usenet or
eternal-september or whatever.

> I bet all of the e-s (and
> related) users even now only see of Jerry Friedman's postings -- if he
> was posting when there was spamming from google spammer were high the
> posts got dropped.

Not only Jerry. Nasty characters like the racist S K is also getting his
posts through e-s. As are others. When an organisation like Google
decide to discontinue a free service (like google groups) they are not
doing it with censorship in mind. They are doing it on the grounds of
financial viability. If they cannot see any profit in it - they'd cut
off their own right arm too.

On Wed, 21 Feb 2024 12:04:56 +0100
occam <occam@nowhere.nix> wrote:

> On 21/02/2024 05:31, Madhu wrote:
> >
> > There is the danger that google will decide that it can do more damage
> > that way and somehow rescind the decision.
>
> Not well phrased, but Google may. (I doubt it.)
>
> >
> > But the damage is already done: I can sympathise with PTD's decision to
> > abstain,
>
> That's a very kind way of putting it. I'd put PDT's 'abstention' down to
> his ineptitude in things technological.
>
> > because (even before google was preventing him from posting
> > with the captcha narrative) his articles were being dropped from
> > eternal-september and its peers who use the same filters. Whats the
> > point of contributing if there is going to be censorship and your
> > articles aren't going to be distributed. (nevermind if the censorship is
> > intended ,on the face of it, or how it is implemented). The "free"
> > nature of usenet posting had been destroyed.
>
> I disagree about 'censorship'. Nothing of the sort. Had PDT been using a
> newsreader, he would not have had any problem with usenet or
> eternal-september or whatever.
>
>
> > I bet all of the e-s (and
> > related) users even now only see of Jerry Friedman's postings -- if he
> > was posting when there was spamming from google spammer were high the
> > posts got dropped.
>
> Not only Jerry. Nasty characters like the racist S K is also getting his
> posts through e-s. As are others. []

He is? then let's lobby Mr Banana to prevent him.

Is there anything you can do to stop this racist form posting?

Begin forwarded message:

Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2024 02:24:53 -0800 (PST)
From: S K <skpflex1@gmail.com>
Newsgroups: alt.usage.english
Subject: going out with a bang - snuff movie of jew soldiers

X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1; AJvYcCXwmqAwN/QQhuqzbqFQ
+NkAznaKGPNwI4CYlxXMq/1kw701rredA1yW2iOso9nGg2N8uZ1hY6sQ1vYYygsY1ac9pnUsmoe9W07yPEoZYVdwI0S1qKs=
X-Received: by 2002:ac8:7f87:0:b0:42c:4c55:3fa5 with SMTP id
z7-20020ac87f87000000b0042c4c553fa5mr536597qtj.10.1708511093460; Wed, 21
Feb 2024 02:24:53 -0800 (PST) X-Forwarded-Encrypted: i=1;
AJvYcCXtgyOA345gwy4a4q4prmzFsle6WuJ2ocHyNgHuJIis8AJJMEVxJh6DRuqMW/IYr34eZSwswvwcrTH
+3HkiyICFgOF92zgW28k8PjGg9QzFeoA78g== X-Received: by
2002:a05:6871:799b:b0:21f:4ff4:28b8 with SMTP id
pb27-20020a056871799b00b0021f4ff428b8mr53399oac.8.1708511093177; Wed, 21
Feb 2024 02:24:53 -0800 (PST) Path: eternal-september.org!
news.eternal-september.org!feeder3.eternal-september.org!
border-1.nntp.ord.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!news-out.google.com!
nntp.google.com!postnews.google.com!google-groups.googlegroups.com!
not-for-mail Newsgroups: alt.usage.english Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2024 02:24:53
-0800 (PST) Injection-Info: google-groups.googlegroups.com;
posting-host=104.148.181.240;
posting-account=3T11hQoAAABNXwW6uDDOjLz7aRH6dlBv NNTP-Posting-Host:
104.148.181.240 User-Agent: G2/1.0 MIME-Version: 1.0 Message-ID:
<3cdbbfba-b315-461c-bb23-550452c11490n@googlegroups.com> Subject: going
out with a bang - snuff movie of jew soldiers From: S K
<skpflex1@gmail.com> Injection-Date: Wed, 21 Feb 2024 10:24:53 +0000
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8" Lines: 1 Xref:
news.eternal-september.org alt.usage.english:1292802

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hv5HbZYj4gk

--
Bah, and indeed Humbug.

On 2024-02-20, Marco Moock wrote:

> As an NNTP server, some free services exist where you have to register:
> https://www.eternal-september.org/
> https://solani.org/
> https://www.i2pn2.org/
> https://news.nntp4.net/

Does anyone know what happened to aioe.org?

--
Bob Dylan knows
And I bet Alan Freed did
There are things in night
That it's better not to behold

On 20 Feb 2024, Indira wrote

> Marco Moock wrote:
>
>> https://news.nntp4.net/
>
> https://news.nntp4.net/
> The user login and registration will be activated on February 22,
> 2024.
>
> What's wrong with paganini.bofh.team:119 (no login/password
> necessary)?

(I can never see that name without this popping into my head...)

"My choir's performing Paganini's "Messiah" this year."

"You mean Handel's Messiah; it's not by Paganini."

"This one's definitely Paganini."

"Nope - it'll be Handel."

"Look, dummy: it says it RIGHT HERE, on the score: The Messiah,
Paganini."

"That's Page Nine."

(Sorry; I'll fetch me coat...)

On 21 Feb 2024, Adam Funk wrote

> On 2024-02-20, Marco Moock wrote:
>
>> As an NNTP server, some free services exist where you have to
>> register: https://www.eternal-september.org/
>> https://solani.org/
>> https://www.i2pn2.org/
>> https://news.nntp4.net/
>
> Does anyone know what happened to aioe.org?

Maybe put out to pasture with too many people mistaking it for eieio?

In article <q57hakx57c.ln2@news.ducksburg.com>, a24061
@ducksburg.com says...
>
> On 2024-02-20, Marco Moock wrote:
>
> > As an NNTP server, some free services exist where you have to register:
> > https://www.eternal-september.org/
> > https://solani.org/
> > https://www.i2pn2.org/
> > https://news.nntp4.net/
>
> Does anyone know what happened to aioe.org?

Probably crushed to death by the sheer weight of its
trolls.

Janet

Adam Funk hat am 21.02.2024 um 13:33 geschrieben:
> On 2024-02-20, Marco Moock wrote:
>
>> As an NNTP server, some free services exist where you have to register:
>> https://www.eternal-september.org/
>> https://solani.org/
>> https://www.i2pn2.org/
>> https://news.nntp4.net/
>
> Does anyone know what happened to aioe.org?

His owner and sole admin got seriously ill and he also had big problems
with his infrastructure, more or less at the same time.

@Janet: The owner and admin of AIOE is the only one who has ever replied
to an abuse complaint from me. He was also extremely engaged against
trolls. Did you ever try writing to abuse@aioe.org in English?

Kerr-Mudd, John wrote:

>> Not only Jerry. Nasty characters like the racist S K is also getting his
>> posts through e-s. As are others. []
>
> He is? then let's lobby Mr Banana to prevent him.
>
> Is there anything you can do to stop this racist form posting?

Back when the usenet server operators still listened to what serious
users wrote to them about abuse, I spent quite a lot of time trying to
shut down an abuser that made PDT and S K seem like sensible people. One
server after another cut him off. He found a new one every time. The
last on was in England, and I had some difficulty proving to the
sysadmin that the Danish messages were in violation of proper conduct.
He understood at last because a message was crossposted between a group
about politics and one about science.

The perpetrator got a new account the same day. Then I gave up.

I think that it's much harder these days.

--
Bertel, Denmark

On 2024-02-21, Silvano wrote:

> Adam Funk hat am 21.02.2024 um 13:33 geschrieben:
>> On 2024-02-20, Marco Moock wrote:
>>
>>> As an NNTP server, some free services exist where you have to register:
>>> https://www.eternal-september.org/
>>> https://solani.org/
>>> https://www.i2pn2.org/
>>> https://news.nntp4.net/
>>
>> Does anyone know what happened to aioe.org?
>
>
> His owner and sole admin got seriously ill and he also had big problems
> with his infrastructure, more or less at the same time.

That explains it, thanks.

> @Janet: The owner and admin of AIOE is the only one who has ever replied
> to an abuse complaint from me. He was also extremely engaged against
> trolls. Did you ever try writing to abuse@aioe.org in English?

--
We live in capitalism. Its power seems inescapable. But then, so did
the divine right of kings. Any human power can be resisted and changed
by human beings. Resistance and change often begin in art. Very often
in the art of words. ---Ursula Le Guin

On 2024-02-21 07:04, HVS wrote:
> On 20 Feb 2024, Indira wrote
>
>> Marco Moock wrote:
>>
>>> https://news.nntp4.net/
>>
>> https://news.nntp4.net/
>> The user login and registration will be activated on February 22,
>> 2024.
>>
>> What's wrong with paganini.bofh.team:119 (no login/password
>> necessary)?
>
> (I can never see that name without this popping into my head...)
>
>
> "My choir's performing Paganini's "Messiah" this year."
>
> "You mean Handel's Messiah; it's not by Paganini."
>
> "This one's definitely Paganini."
>
> "Nope - it'll be Handel."
>
> "Look, dummy: it says it RIGHT HERE, on the score: The Messiah,
> Paganini."
>
> "That's Page Nine."

My favourite Goon Show gag:

"Moriarty, what are you doing in the piano?"
"I'm hidin'!"
"Don't be silly, Haydn's been dead for years!"

--
“Why do they call it rush hour when nothing moves?”
—Robin Williams

On 22/02/24 00:10, HVS wrote:
> On 21 Feb 2024, Adam Funk wrote
>
>> On 2024-02-20, Marco Moock wrote:
>>
>>> As an NNTP server, some free services exist where you have to
>>> register: https://www.eternal-september.org/
>>> https://solani.org/
>>> https://www.i2pn2.org/
>>> https://news.nntp4.net/
>>
>> Does anyone know what happened to aioe.org?
>
> Maybe put out to pasture with too many people mistaking it for eieio?

I once had a computer with EIA I/O.

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW

Marco Moock wrote:

> There is no special reason for not listing servers.

But there is a special reason for listing the bastard operator from hell.
It's the easiest of all to set up (no login, no password, no encryption).

> I could have listed 20.

Not really. People have tried. Even you have tried. Twenty is too many.
You can list twenty, but most of what you list is special case stuff.

Like only works for Australian IP addresses.
Or only handles Spanish-language newsgroups.

You could list five though.
And you'd run out somewhere between five and ten.

But without aioe, netfront, mixmin, dizum, etc., only one will be the
easiest because Paolo, Steve and others got out of that business recently.

Which is why I had asked what's wrong with Ivo Gondalfo's bofh server
if the goal is to make it easy for Google groupies to post to Usenet.

Bertel Lund Hansen wrote:

> I think that it's much harder these days.

Wolfgang responds to requests. I know this because he's banned people at my
request, but he asks for proof with headers so you have to know how.

One problem Wolfgang (aka Ray Banana) has is similar to the issues Steve
Crook faced, as did Jessie Rehmer and all the rest of the free server
admins, is people have different moral compasses.

Some of which are merely highly judgmental ideas of what others should
post, while others are true spamming and true trolling.

On 21 Feb 2024, lar3ryca wrote

> On 2024-02-21 07:04, HVS wrote:

>> "My choir's performing Paganini's "Messiah" this year."
>>
>> "You mean Handel's Messiah; it's not by Paganini."
>>
>> "This one's definitely Paganini."
>>
>> "Nope - it'll be Handel."
>>
>> "Look, dummy: it says it RIGHT HERE, on the score: The Messiah,
>> Paganini."
>>
>> "That's Page Nine."
>
> My favourite Goon Show gag:
>
> "Moriarty, what are you doing in the piano?"
> "I'm hidin'!"
> "Don't be silly, Haydn's been dead for years!"

(grin)

Stefan Ram blurted out:
> Rich Ulrich <rich.ulrich@comcast.net> writes:
>> On Tue, 20 Feb 2024 12:07:45 +0100, Marco Moock
>> <mm+usenet-es@dorfdsl.de> wrote:
>>> This is only relevant for those people who read or post in that
>>> newsgroup using Google Groups.
>> Thanks -- That looks to be thorough.
>
> So, it's ok to refer to the very newsgroup you post in with "that"?

Not really, but it's a minor imperfection. From my reading,
"that group" should be a more generic form: any one of "a newsgroup"
[no "that"], "newsgroups", or "any newsgroups". Or else more specific,
tas in "this group".

/dps

--
"What do you think of my cart, Miss Morland? A neat one, is not it?
Well hung: curricle-hung in fact. Come sit by me and we'll test the
springs."
(Speculative fiction by H.Lacedaemonian.)