On 30/12/23 00:02, Snidely wrote:
> Just this Friday, Peter Moylan explained that ...
>> On 29/12/23 03:01, lar3ryca wrote:
>>>
>>> While researching the latitudes of London and Reading, I wondered
>>> about the latitude of my house, and what city in the UK might be the
>>> same.
>>>
>>> I live at about 50 24 32N (50.408974N), so in the UK, Galmpton Is
>>> also at that latitude.
>>
>> How did you find that information? I live at 32.93193S, but I'm
>> struggling to find places at a similar latitude. Google Maps doesn't
>> seem to understand the concept of "latitude". In the southern
>> hemisphere, I can find very approximate matches in South Africa and a
>> slice of South America, but don't know how to find more exact matches.
>
> East London, South Africa? -32.99736
> Mendoza, Argentina? -32.89255
> Rosario, Argentina? -32.94700
>
>> In the northern hemisphere, the closest I can come to the UK is
>> somewhere in Algeria. The best match in the USA seems to be Dallas,
>> Texas.
>
> Goose Creek, South Carolina? +32.97190
> (A suburb of Charleston, from the looks of things)
>
>
> I just did a visual search, right-clicking where it was promising.

Thanks to all who answered. I must admit that I had completely forgotten
about Google Earth. I installed in many years ago, but that was also
many computers ago. Now I see that it has become something that doesn't
have to be installed. Maybe I'll do some more exploring.

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW

Peter Moylan was thinking very hard :
> On 30/12/23 00:02, Snidely wrote:
>> Just this Friday, Peter Moylan explained that ...
>>> On 29/12/23 03:01, lar3ryca wrote:
>>>>
>>>> While researching the latitudes of London and Reading, I wondered
>>>> about the latitude of my house, and what city in the UK might be the
>>>> same.
>>>>
>>>> I live at about 50 24 32N (50.408974N), so in the UK, Galmpton Is
>>>> also at that latitude.
>>>
>>> How did you find that information? I live at 32.93193S, but I'm
>>> struggling to find places at a similar latitude. Google Maps doesn't
>>> seem to understand the concept of "latitude". In the southern
>>> hemisphere, I can find very approximate matches in South Africa and a
>>> slice of South America, but don't know how to find more exact matches.
>>
>> East London, South Africa? -32.99736
>> Mendoza, Argentina? -32.89255
>> Rosario, Argentina? -32.94700
>>
>>> In the northern hemisphere, the closest I can come to the UK is
>>> somewhere in Algeria. The best match in the USA seems to be Dallas,
>>> Texas.
>>
>> Goose Creek, South Carolina? +32.97190
>> (A suburb of Charleston, from the looks of things)
>>
>>
>> I just did a visual search, right-clicking where it was promising.
>
> Thanks to all who answered. I must admit that I had completely forgotten
> about Google Earth. I installed in many years ago, but that was also
> many computers ago. Now I see that it has become something that doesn't
> have to be installed. Maybe I'll do some more exploring.

I have Google Earth, but I used Google Maps, despite the projection
errors.

/dps

--
There's nothing inherently wrong with Big Data. What matters, as it
does for Arnold Lund in California or Richard Rothman in Baltimore, are
the questions -- old and new, good and bad -- this newest tool lets us
ask. (R. Lerhman, CSMonitor.com)

Le 29/12/2023 à 17:37, Bertel Lund Hansen a écrit :
> Hibou wrote:
> [...]
>>> It takes me to Kirkcaldy, a small town 20 kms North of Edinburgh.
>>
>> But can you pronounce 'Kirkcaldy'?
>
> I have no idea what the correct pronunciation is. I just took the
> village nearest to the eastcoast.

Fair enough.

On 2023-12-29 21:26:04 +0000, Ian Jackson said:

> In message <kv0rqvFsgfU1@mid.individual.net>, Athel Cornish-Bowden
> <me@yahoo.com> writes
>> On 2023-12-26 20:20:28 +0000, Ross Clark said:
>>
>>> On 26/12/2023 7:47 p.m., occam wrote:
>>>> Headline: "Bodies of five people found in flat in Paris suburb of Meaux"
>>>> Later:
>>>> "Their bodies were found in the town of Meaux which is just over 41km
>>>> (25 miles) from the French capital."
>>>> 25 miles away is a big stretch of the definition of 'suburb', at least
>>>> by European standards. It's like calling Watford a suburb of London. (It
>>>> is not.) Or like calling Rotterdam a suburb of the Hague.
>>>> Source: https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-67821163
>>>> What were the writers thinking?
>>>>
>>> This morning I was a bit startled to hear the radio news refer to
>>> Pukekohe (where there was a house fire in which someone died) as an
>>> "Auckland suburb". It's about 40km from the centre of Auckland, and
>>> separated by several km of open country from the nearest parts of the
>>> "continuous urbanized area". (Similar situation to Meaux.)
>>> Wikipedia "Pukekohe" calls it a "town in the Auckland region", which is
>>> what I would have said. But Wikipedia "Auckland" includes it in
>>> Auckland's "functional urban area (commuting zone)". And that open
>>> country is slowly but steadily filling in with new housing and stuff
>>> along the highways.
>>> I don't know what the people of Pukekohe would think about the matter,
>>> but apparently in the case of Watford it's a touchy issue. A google
>>> query led me to:
>>> Q. Is Watford a suburb of London?
>>> A. It is not part of London, but it is located within the London
>>> commuter belt and is close to the Greater London area. If you suggested
>>> to a resident if Watford that they lived in London you would get very
>>> short shrift.
>>> What I take from this is that calling Watford a suburb of London is not
>>> unthinkable (as in your reductio), but something that some people
>>> might actually do.
>>
>> London people say that the North begins at Watford.
>>
> It actually refers to a different Watford (a village in
> Northamptonshire, some 50 miles northwards of London), and the
> expression is that The North begins at The Watford Gap (a gap in the
> hills).
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Watford_Gap#External_links

OK. We non-Londoners say that Londoners say that the North begins at Watford.

--
Athel cb

On Fri, 29 Dec 2023, at 10:41:36, occam posted:
>On 28/12/2023 23:49, Paul Wolff wrote:
>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2023, at 10:07:57, Janet posted:
>>> me@yahoo.com says...

>>>> Also, is "north-east" acceptable for a place that is a small bit north
>>>> of east? Would you say that Reading was south-west of London?
>>>
>>> No, because Reading is north-west of London.
>>>
>> The real point is that Reading is South of the River, and that's all
>> that matters to the people of London on the north bank of the Thames.
>
>Quite right! Just as Watford defines the start of 'The North' for
>Londoners, the river Thames defines the boundary between civilisation
>and the South. France begins when you cross the river, ask any cabbie.
>
>> Reading's real native river is the Kennet which just happens to debouch
>> into the Thames a mile or two downstream of biscuit-town.
>
>It's the first I hear of 'biscuit town'. Please elaborate.
>
I can't quote any source, but I'm a Berkshire lad, so have Authority.
Three B's for Reading: Beer, Bulbs and Biscuits.

The town's principal brewery was Simonds, the bulbs were Sutton's Seeds,
and the biscuits Huntley and Palmers.

An enthusiastic write-up here:
>https://www.berkshirehistory.com/articles/reading_3Bs.html>

--
Paul W

On 29 Dec 2023, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote

> On 2023-12-29 13:00:31 +0000, Bertel Lund Hansen said:
>
>> lar3ryca wrote:
>>
>>> I have two questions about Galmpton.
>>>
>>> 1. How is it pronounced?
>>
>> Here is a page I found. I have no idea how reliable the example
>> is.
>>
>> https://www.howtopronounce.com/galmpton
>
> The same page offers three ways to pronounce Asunción, all three
> wrong. So I wouldn't put much confidence in the result for
> Galmpton. (They spell it Asuncion, but that's also wrong, whether
> they mean the ordinary word or the capital of Paraguay.)
>
>

On 29 Dec 2023, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote

> On 2023-12-29 13:00:31 +0000, Bertel Lund Hansen said:
>
>> lar3ryca wrote:
>>
>>> I have two questions about Galmpton.
>>>
>>> 1. How is it pronounced?
>>
>> Here is a page I found. I have no idea how reliable the example
>> is.
>>
>> https://www.howtopronounce.com/galmpton
>
> The same page offers three ways to pronounce Asunción, all three
> wrong. So I wouldn't put much confidence in the result for
> Galmpton. (They spell it Asuncion, but that's also wrong, whether
> they mean the ordinary word or the capital of Paraguay.)
>
>

On 29 Dec 2023, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote

> On 2023-12-29 13:00:31 +0000, Bertel Lund Hansen said:
>
>> lar3ryca wrote:
>>
>>> I have two questions about Galmpton.
>>>
>>> 1. How is it pronounced?
>>
>> Here is a page I found. I have no idea how reliable the example
>> is.
>>
>> https://www.howtopronounce.com/galmpton
>
> The same page offers three ways to pronounce Asunción, all three
> wrong. So I wouldn't put much confidence in the result for
> Galmpton. (They spell it Asuncion, but that's also wrong, whether
> they mean the ordinary word or the capital of Paraguay.)

I've always found user-generated pronunciation sites of absolutely no
use at all -- there's no way to know who's posted the sound samples,
or if they have any expertise at all beyond their own guesses.

FWIW, I found a relevant multi-part article from the 1980s by someone
called Christopher E B Powell, who appears to have worked in ESL
circles in Japan and lists a fair number of papers on similar
matters.

The pronunciation he gives for "Galmpton" essentially just drops the
"l". (The question marks in the following are supposed to be a
"reversed e", which I've never found how to generate in XNews....)

(quote)

GALM � Galmpton (Dev,) [�g�mpt?n]. cf. Yealmpton, below.

YEALM �- River Yealm (Dev.) [jaem] and Yealmpton (Dev.) [�j�mt?n].

(end quote)

The five parts are here -- GALM is in the third part, while YEALM is
is in the fourth:

Part 1: https://konan-wu.repo.nii.ac.jp/record/464/files/017-08.pdf
Part 2: https://konan-wu.repo.nii.ac.jp/record/476/files/018-07.pdf
Part 3: https://konan-wu.repo.nii.ac.jp/record/490/files/019-04.pdf
Part 4: https://konan-wu.repo.nii.ac.jp/record/506/files/020-07.pdf
Part 5: https://konan-wu.repo.nii.ac.jp/record/535/files/021-24.pdf

--
Cheers, Harvey

Apologies for the repeated text in my response -- I was trying to see
if I could manage to generate the "reversed e" symbol, and completely
screwed up with my cuts-and-pastes....

--
Cheers, Harvey

On 30/12/2023 16:41, Paul Wolff wrote:
> On Fri, 29 Dec 2023, at 10:41:36, occam posted:
>> On 28/12/2023 23:49, Paul Wolff wrote:

>>> Reading's real native river is the Kennet which just happens to debouch
>>> into the Thames a mile or two downstream of biscuit-town.
>>
>> It's the first I hear of 'biscuit town'. Please elaborate.
>>
> I can't quote any source, but I'm a Berkshire lad, so have Authority.
> Three B's for Reading: Beer, Bulbs and Biscuits.
>
> The town's principal brewery was Simonds, the bulbs were Sutton's Seeds,
> and the biscuits Huntley and Palmers.
>
> An enthusiastic write-up here:
>  >https://www.berkshirehistory.com/articles/reading_3Bs.html>
>
Also, Reading FC were historically known as "The Biscuitmen".

--
Ray
UK

On 2023-12-30 17:12:37 +0000, HVS said:

> On 29 Dec 2023, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote
>
>> On 2023-12-29 13:00:31 +0000, Bertel Lund Hansen said:
>>
>>> lar3ryca wrote:
>>>
>>>> I have two questions about Galmpton.
>>>>
>>>> 1. How is it pronounced?
>>>
>>> Here is a page I found. I have no idea how reliable the example
>>> is.
>>>
>>> https://www.howtopronounce.com/galmpton
>>
>> The same page offers three ways to pronounce Asunción, all three
>> wrong. So I wouldn't put much confidence in the result for
>> Galmpton. (They spell it Asuncion, but that's also wrong, whether
>> they mean the ordinary word or the capital of Paraguay.)
>>
[repeated quotation skipped]
>
> I've always found user-generated pronunciation sites of absolutely no
> use at all -- there's no way to know who's posted the sound samples,
> or if they have any expertise at all beyond their own guesses.
>
> FWIW, I found a relevant multi-part article from the 1980s by someone
> called Christopher E B Powell, who appears to have worked in ESL
> circles in Japan and lists a fair number of papers on similar
> matters.
>
> The pronunciation he gives for "Galmpton" essentially just drops the
> "l". (The question marks in the following are supposed to be a
> "reversed e", which I've never found how to generate in XNews....)
>
>
> (quote)
>
> GALM – Galmpton (Dev,) [‘gæmpt?n]. cf. Yealmpton, below.

I should have thought of Yealmton, as it's a better example than
Cullompton, as it has now vowel between the l and the m.
>
> YEALM –- River Yealm (Dev.) [jaem] and Yealmpton (Dev.) [‘jæmt?n].
>
> (end quote)
>
>
> The five parts are here -- GALM is in the third part, while YEALM is
> is in the fourth:
>
> Part 1: https://konan-wu.repo.nii.ac.jp/record/464/files/017-08.pdf
> Part 2: https://konan-wu.repo.nii.ac.jp/record/476/files/018-07.pdf
> Part 3: https://konan-wu.repo.nii.ac.jp/record/490/files/019-04.pdf
> Part 4: https://konan-wu.repo.nii.ac.jp/record/506/files/020-07.pdf
> Part 5: https://konan-wu.repo.nii.ac.jp/record/535/files/021-24.pdf

--
Athel -- French and British, living in Marseilles for 36 years; mainly
in England until 1987.

On 2023-12-29 12:02, lar3ryca wrote:
> On 2023-12-29 06:26, Peter Moylan wrote:
>> On 29/12/23 03:01, lar3ryca wrote:
>>>
>>> While researching the latitudes of London and Reading, I wondered
>>> about the latitude of my house, and what city in the UK might be the
>>> same.
>>>
>>> I live at about 50 24 32N (50.408974N), so in the UK, Galmpton Is
>>> also at that latitude.
>>
>> How did you find that information?
>
> Google Earth.

Speaking of Google Earth, check out the formation at

50° 0'38.20"N 110° 6'48.32"W

It's in Alberta.

--
I tried making orange juice from concentrate,
but all I got was a really bad headache.

HVS wrote:

> "l". (The question marks in the following are supposed to be a
> "reversed e", which I've never found how to generate in XNews....)

https://www.fileformat.info/info/charset/UTF-8/list.htm

Text-search for "small letter reversed e" in that order. That gives you
a character you can copy.

ɘ

--
Bertel, Denmark

On 30/12/2023 18:31, musika wrote:
> On 30/12/2023 16:41, Paul Wolff wrote:
>> On Fri, 29 Dec 2023, at 10:41:36, occam posted:
>>> On 28/12/2023 23:49, Paul Wolff wrote:
>
>>>> Reading's real native river is the Kennet which just happens to debouch
>>>> into the Thames a mile or two downstream of biscuit-town.
>>>
>>> It's the first I hear of 'biscuit town'. Please elaborate.
>>>
>> I can't quote any source, but I'm a Berkshire lad, so have Authority.
>> Three B's for Reading: Beer, Bulbs and Biscuits.
>>
>> The town's principal brewery was Simonds, the bulbs were Sutton's
>> Seeds, and the biscuits Huntley and Palmers.
>>
>> An enthusiastic write-up here:
>>   >https://www.berkshirehistory.com/articles/reading_3Bs.html>
>>
> Also, Reading FC were historically known as "The Biscuitmen".
>

I take it (from the three Bs) that they could equally have been called
"The Beermen" or "The Bulbmen"? Hmm.

On 2023-12-31 10:04:12 +0000, occam said:

> On 30/12/2023 18:31, musika wrote:
>> On 30/12/2023 16:41, Paul Wolff wrote:
>>> On Fri, 29 Dec 2023, at 10:41:36, occam posted:
>>>> On 28/12/2023 23:49, Paul Wolff wrote:
>>
>>>>> Reading's real native river is the Kennet which just happens to debouch
>>>>> into the Thames a mile or two downstream of biscuit-town.
>>>>
>>>> It's the first I hear of 'biscuit town'. Please elaborate.
>>>>
>>> I can't quote any source, but I'm a Berkshire lad, so have Authority.
>>> Three B's for Reading: Beer, Bulbs and Biscuits.
>>>
>>> The town's principal brewery was Simonds, the bulbs were Sutton's
>>> Seeds, and the biscuits Huntley and Palmers.
>>>
>>> An enthusiastic write-up here:
>>>   >https://www.berkshirehistory.com/articles/reading_3Bs.html>
>>>
>> Also, Reading FC were historically known as "The Biscuitmen".
>>
>
> I take it (from the three Bs) that they could equally have been called
> "The Beermen" or "The Bulbmen"? Hmm.

I have no opinion about "bulbmen", but "beermen" won't really do
because there are other towns far more closely associated with brewing,
such as Burton-on-Trent. All DuckDuckGo-hits for "Reading brewing" are
for some place in the USA.

--
Athel cb

On 30 Dec 2023, Bertel Lund Hansen wrote

> HVS wrote:
>
>> "l". (The question marks in the following are supposed to be a
>> "reversed e", which I've never found how to generate in
>> XNews....)
>
> https://www.fileformat.info/info/charset/UTF-8/list.htm
>
> Text-search for "small letter reversed e" in that order. That
> gives you a character you can copy.
>
> ɘ
>

Thanks for that - I've made a note of it for next time.

--
Cheers,
Harvey

On 2023-12-31 05:04, HVS wrote:
> On 30 Dec 2023, Bertel Lund Hansen wrote
>
>> HVS wrote:
>>
>>> "l". (The question marks in the following are supposed to be a
>>> "reversed e", which I've never found how to generate in
>>> XNews....)
>>
>> https://www.fileformat.info/info/charset/UTF-8/list.htm
>>
>> Text-search for "small letter reversed e" in that order. That
>> gives you a character you can copy.
>>
>> ɘ
>
> Thanks for that - I've made a note of it for next time.

I made a little script to generate the Unicode characters I use most often.

--
If any two days of your life are the same, one of them was unnecessary.
-James P. Hogan

On Sat, 30 Dec 2023, at 17:31:27, musika posted:
>On 30/12/2023 16:41, Paul Wolff wrote:
>> On Fri, 29 Dec 2023, at 10:41:36, occam posted:
>>> On 28/12/2023 23:49, Paul Wolff wrote:
>
>>>> Reading's real native river is the Kennet which just happens to debouch
>>>> into the Thames a mile or two downstream of biscuit-town.
>>>
>>> It's the first I hear of 'biscuit town'. Please elaborate.
>>>
>> I can't quote any source, but I'm a Berkshire lad, so have Authority.
>>Three B's for Reading: Beer, Bulbs and Biscuits.
>> The town's principal brewery was Simonds, the bulbs were Sutton's
>>Seeds, and the biscuits Huntley and Palmers.
>> An enthusiastic write-up here:
>>  >https://www.berkshirehistory.com/articles/reading_3Bs.html>
>>
>Also, Reading FC were historically known as "The Biscuitmen".
>
Thanks for the memory-jog.
--
Paul W

On 31/12/23 22:04, HVS wrote:
> On 30 Dec 2023, Bertel Lund Hansen wrote
>
>> HVS wrote:
>>
>>> "l". (The question marks in the following are supposed to be a
>>> "reversed e", which I've never found how to generate in
>>> XNews....)
>>
>> https://www.fileformat.info/info/charset/UTF-8/list.htm
>>
>> Text-search for "small letter reversed e" in that order. That gives
>> you a character you can copy.
>>
>> ɘ
>
> Thanks for that - I've made a note of it for next time.

Note, though, that your posting software (XNews) doesn't have MIME
support, so might not be able to post in UTF-8.

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW

On 31 Dec 2023, Peter Moylan wrote

> On 31/12/23 22:04, HVS wrote:
>> On 30 Dec 2023, Bertel Lund Hansen wrote
>>
>>> HVS wrote:
>>>
>>>> "l". (The question marks in the following are supposed to be a
>>>> "reversed e", which I've never found how to generate in
>>>> XNews....)
>>>
>>> https://www.fileformat.info/info/charset/UTF-8/list.htm
>>>
>>> Text-search for "small letter reversed e" in that order. That
gives
>>> you a character you can copy.
>>>
>>> ɘ
>>
>> Thanks for that - I've made a note of it for next time.
>
> Note, though, that your posting software (XNews) doesn't have MIME
> support, so might not be able to post in UTF-8.
>

Ah - thanks; I seem to recall a problem with MIME and UTF-8, but
it's been so many years since I set XNews up in the way that
generally suits me that I can't remember the details.

I might poke around under the bonnet and look at the settings to see
if I can enlighten myself...

--
Cheers, Harvey

-- literally decad

On Thu, 28 Dec 2023 19:35:26 +0000
Sam Plusnet <not@home.com> wrote:

> On 28-Dec-23 6:55, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
> > On 2023-12-28 06:44:51 +0000, Snidely said:
> >
> >> Wednesday, Hibou murmurred ...
> >>> Le 27/12/2023 à 10:48, Athel Cornish-Bowden a écrit :
> >>>> On 2023-12-27 10:07:57 +0000, Janet said:
> >>>>> In article <kv2965F93m2U1@mid.individual.net>,
> >>>>> me@yahoo.com says...
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Also, is "north-east" acceptable for a place that is a small bit
> >>>>>> north
> >>>>>> of east? Would you say that Reading was south-west of London?
> >>>>>
> >>>>>  No, because Reading is north-west of London.
> >>>>
> >>>> Not according to Google Maps it isn't. Charing Cross is
> >>>> traditionally used as the point from which distances from London are
> >>>> defined, and Reading is slightly south of Charing Cross.
> >>>
> >>> Well, they're poles apart, anyway.
> >>
> >> Do you mean rods?  We can chain your answers together.
> >
> > And perch on top of them.
>
> Many people will not understand this so you're hiding your light under a
> bushel, but this thread has been a tun of fun.
>
Firkin hell, you've got us pinned over a barrel.
--
Bah, and indeed Humbug.

On 27/12/2023 09:30, Athel Cornish-Bowden wrote:
> Would you say that Reading was south-west of London?

Only if you buy me dinner first. ;O)

Actually I have no idea where Reading is in connection with London.
I live about 400 miles away in a different country from England.

On 28/12/2023 06:44, Snidely wrote:
> Wednesday, Hibou murmurred ...

>> Well, they're poles apart, anyway.
>
> Do you mean rods?  We can chain your answers together.

Shades of ye Shedde (UK.Rec.Sheds)

Thursday, soup quipped:
> On 28/12/2023 06:44, Snidely wrote:
>> Wednesday, Hibou murmurred ...
>
>>> Well, they're poles apart, anyway.
>>
>> Do you mean rods?  We can chain your answers together.
>
> Shades of ye Shedde (UK.Rec.Sheds)

Under the spreading chestnut tree.

-d

--
You could try being nicer and politer
> instead, and see how that works out.
-- Katy Jennison

On 05-Jan-24 9:09, Snidely wrote:
> Thursday, soup quipped:
>> On 28/12/2023 06:44, Snidely wrote:
>>> Wednesday, Hibou murmurred ...
>>
>>>> Well, they're poles apart, anyway.
>>>
>>> Do you mean rods?  We can chain your answers together.
>>
>> Shades of ye Shedde (UK.Rec.Sheds)
>
> Under the spreading chestnut tree.

Haven't come across chestnut spread.

Recipe?

--
Sam Plusnet

Sam Plusnet hat am 05.01.2024 um 18:44 geschrieben:
> On 05-Jan-24 9:09, Snidely wrote:
>> Under the spreading chestnut tree.
>
> Haven't come across chestnut spread.
>
> Recipe?

Orwell's 1984.