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interests / alt.usage.english / Re: than you've ever seen

than you've ever seen

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Subject: than you've ever seen
From: arthurvarr@gmail.com (arthurvv vart)
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by: arthurvv vart - Wed, 27 Dec 2023 09:55 UTC

1) The statue you are about to see is more amazing than you've
ever seen.

Meaning: The statue you are about to see is more amazing than any stature
you've ever seen.

---------------

2) The book you are about to start reading is more intense than you've ever
read.

Meaning: The book you are about to start reading is more intense than any book you've read.

Are '1' and '2' grammatical and do they correspond to their attributed
meanings?

Gratefully,
Navi

Lost in the Twilight Zone of the English language
Interested in structures on the margins of grammaticality
Obsessed with ambiguity

Re: than you've ever seen

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From: vpaereru-unmonitored@yahoo.com.invalid (Hibou)
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Subject: Re: than you've ever seen
Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2023 10:50:01 +0000
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by: Hibou - Wed, 27 Dec 2023 10:50 UTC

Le 27/12/2023 à 09:55, arthurvv vart a écrit :
>
> 1) The statue you are about to see is more amazing than you've
> ever seen.
>
> Meaning: The statue you are about to see is more amazing than any stature
> you've ever seen.
>
> ---------------
>
> 2) The book you are about to start reading is more intense than you've ever
> read.
>
> Meaning: The book you are about to start reading is more intense than any book you've read.
>
> Are '1' and '2' grammatical and do they correspond to their attributed
> meanings?

I think not. The missing 'any' is strident.

The statue you're about to see is more amazing than any you've seen before.

(A risky statement. The speaker is unlikely to know what statues I've
seen before, and I'll be the judge of what I find amazing. The proper
response, therefore, is "Oh yes? Let's see.")

Re: than you've ever seen

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From: peter@pmoylan.org.invalid (Peter Moylan)
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Subject: Re: than you've ever seen
Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2023 10:36:54 +1100
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by: Peter Moylan - Wed, 27 Dec 2023 23:36 UTC

On 27/12/23 21:50, Hibou wrote:
> Le 27/12/2023 à 09:55, arthurvv vart a écrit :
>>
>> 1) The statue you are about to see is more amazing than you've
>> ever seen.
>>
>> Meaning: The statue you are about to see is more amazing than any stature
>> you've ever seen.
>>
>> ---------------
>>
>> 2) The book you are about to start reading is more intense than you've
>> ever
>> read.
>>
>> Meaning: The book you are about to start reading is more intense than
>> any book you've read.
>>
>> Are '1' and '2' grammatical and do they correspond to their attributed
>> meanings?
>
> I think not. The missing 'any' is strident.
>
> The statue you're about to see is more amazing than any you've seen before.
>
> (A risky statement. The speaker is unlikely to know what statues I've
> seen before, and I'll be the judge of what I find amazing. The proper
> response, therefore, is "Oh yes? Let's see.")

It's a little worse than that. With the "any" included (and I agree that
that's essential) it's at least clear that "any statue" or "any book" is
meant. Without it, sentence (1) really means

1a) The statue you are about to see is more amazing than anything -- any
statue, any painting, any natural scene -- you've ever seen.

Thus it raises questions like "Is it really more amazing than General
Relativity?"

--
Peter Moylan http://www.pmoylan.org
Newcastle, NSW

Re: than you've ever seen

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From: snidely.too@gmail.com (Snidely)
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Subject: Re: than you've ever seen
Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2023 02:48:38 -0800
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by: Snidely - Thu, 28 Dec 2023 10:48 UTC

On Wednesday, Peter Moylan pointed out that ...
> On 27/12/23 21:50, Hibou wrote:
>> Le 27/12/2023 à 09:55, arthurvv vart a écrit :
>>>
>>> 1) The statue you are about to see is more amazing than you've
>>> ever seen.
>>>
>>> Meaning: The statue you are about to see is more amazing than any stature
>>> you've ever seen.
>>>
>>> ---------------
>>>
>>> 2) The book you are about to start reading is more intense than you've
>>> ever
>>> read.
>>>
>>> Meaning: The book you are about to start reading is more intense than
>>> any book you've read.
>>>
>>> Are '1' and '2' grammatical and do they correspond to their attributed
>>> meanings?
>>
>> I think not. The missing 'any' is strident.
>>
>> The statue you're about to see is more amazing than any you've seen before.
>>
>> (A risky statement. The speaker is unlikely to know what statues I've
>> seen before, and I'll be the judge of what I find amazing. The proper
>> response, therefore, is "Oh yes? Let's see.")
>
> It's a little worse than that. With the "any" included (and I agree that
> that's essential) it's at least clear that "any statue" or "any book" is
> meant. Without it, sentence (1) really means
>
> 1a) The statue you are about to see is more amazing than anything -- any
> statue, any painting, any natural scene -- you've ever seen.
>
> Thus it raises questions like "Is it really more amazing than General
> Relativity?"

It is, but not more amazing than Quantum Chromodynamics.

/dps

--
"I am not given to exaggeration, and when I say a thing I mean it"
_Roughing It_, Mark Twain

Subject	Author
than you've ever seen	arthurvv vart
Re: than you've ever seen	Hibou
Re: than you've ever seen	Peter Moylan
Re: than you've ever seen	Snidely