This is a former BR carriage:
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GLR5xOhXwAAwY_A.jpg

Can you identify where this worked, and where it is now?

Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
> This is a former BR carriage:
> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GLR5xOhXwAAwY_A.jpg
>
> Can you identify where this worked, and where it is now?

I spot FGW glow sticks, and the door layout suggests a former first class
carriage.

Is that one of the Mexican HSTs?

Theo

Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:
> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>> This is a former BR carriage:
>> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GLR5xOhXwAAwY_A.jpg
>>
>> Can you identify where this worked, and where it is now?
>
> I spot FGW glow sticks, and the door layout suggests a former first class
> carriage.

Yes, former GWR HST Mk 3.

>
> Is that one of the Mexican HSTs?

Lagos Red Line:
https://punchng.com/eight-things-to-know-about-the-lagos-red-line-rail-project/

Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
> Lagos Red Line:
> https://punchng.com/eight-things-to-know-about-the-lagos-red-line-rail-project/

Sounds like they have an 'interesting' rolling stock procurement:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lagos_Rail_Mass_Transit

"In September 2011, LAMATA announced that it would acquire some H5-series
subway trains formerly used by the Toronto Transit Commission (TTC). The
cars were to be refurbished in the United States and converted to standard
gauge before being imported and put into service on the Blue and Red lines.
The same contract also included an option for some H6-series subway cars
from the TTC, however this has since been cancelled.[17][18][19][20]

In January 2015, LAMATA opted for Chinese-built trains instead, ordering 15
electro-diesel multiple units from CRRC Dalian with an option for 14
more.[21] About 76 H5 cars that had been taken for refurbishment to Buffalo,
New York, have been scrapped by August 2015.[22]

In August 2018, LAMATA signed an agreement with Alstom. As a part of the
agreement, Alstom conducted a review of the rail lines, and electrification
of a portion of the track was planned.[23]

In January 2022, Lagos State Governor Babajide Sanwo-Olu visited the US
state of Wisconsin, to purchase two Talgo VIII trainsets for service on the
Red Line.[24][25] They had been ordered by Wisconsin for use on the Amtrak
Hiawatha Service in 2009, but they were never placed in service, and were
instead stored"

Seems like they're using HST power cars too... on a 22 mile metro service
with 13 stops? Any bets for how long until they break?

Theo

Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
> Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:
>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>> This is a former BR carriage:
>>> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GLR5xOhXwAAwY_A.jpg
>>>
>>> Can you identify where this worked, and where it is now?
>>
>> I spot FGW glow sticks, and the door layout suggests a former first class
>> carriage.
>
> Yes, former GWR HST Mk 3.
>
>>
>> Is that one of the Mexican HSTs?
>
> Lagos Red Line:
> https://punchng.com/eight-things-to-know-about-the-lagos-red-line-rail-project/
>

Looks like imaginative reuse use of the seating as well rather than buy
new.
Here though there would be howls from passengers complaining that they
have an obstructed view through the Windows.

GH

On 16/04/2024 19:46, Marland wrote:
> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Theo <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> wrote:
>>> Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> This is a former BR carriage:
>>>> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GLR5xOhXwAAwY_A.jpg
>>>>
>>>> Can you identify where this worked, and where it is now?
>>>
>>> I spot FGW glow sticks, and the door layout suggests a former first class
>>> carriage.
>>
>> Yes, former GWR HST Mk 3.
>>
>>>
>>> Is that one of the Mexican HSTs?
>>
>> Lagos Red Line:
>> https://punchng.com/eight-things-to-know-about-the-lagos-red-line-rail-project/
>>
>
> Looks like imaginative reuse use of the seating as well rather than buy
> new.
> Here though there would be howls from passengers complaining that they
> have an obstructed view through the Windows.
>

No, there would be howls from people with nowhere to put their laptops.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

In message <uvmh8j$13du0$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:49:55 on Tue, 16 Apr
2024, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:

>there would be howls from people with nowhere to put their laptops.

I was on a Thameslink 700 last week for over an hour (it was pretty much
"all shacks" to Kings Cross) and very surprised to find neither power
sockets nor tables/seat-back-trays for my laptop.

It's about time they rebranded those services back to Great Northern,
because five years on, there's no sign of them ever running through the
core, as originally planned.

The train back was an Electrostar, and felt like luxury by comparison.

This was at Royston, and they were also running an hourly semifast, but
decided to dispatch that just as the bus-load of passengers from
Cambridge North were crossing the tracks[1] on the footbridge. I queried
this with the platform staff, and it's fair to say that they cared
rather less than a flying fuck about the whole thing.

[1] Some genius having decided to use the car park on the northern side
of the station for the replacement buses, even though all trains
were using the platform on the southern side. One quick fix would be
to use the platform on the northern side, and the whole station area
is bi-directionally signalled.
--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
> In message <uvmh8j$13du0$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:49:55 on Tue, 16 Apr
> 2024, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:
>
>> there would be howls from people with nowhere to put their laptops.
>
> I was on a Thameslink 700 last week for over an hour (it was pretty much
> "all shacks" to Kings Cross) and very surprised to find neither power
> sockets nor tables/seat-back-trays for my laptop.
>
> It's about time they rebranded those services back to Great Northern,
> because five years on, there's no sign of them ever running through the
> core, as originally planned.

The 379s will be used on GN services, so the 700s can be returned to TL.

In message <mHNTN.28672$jC2.6737@fx06.ams1>, at 10:41:22 on Wed, 17 Apr
2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>> In message <uvmh8j$13du0$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:49:55 on Tue, 16 Apr
>> 2024, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:
>>
>>> there would be howls from people with nowhere to put their laptops.
>>
>> I was on a Thameslink 700 last week for over an hour (it was pretty much
>> "all shacks" to Kings Cross) and very surprised to find neither power
>> sockets nor tables/seat-back-trays for my laptop.
>>
>> It's about time they rebranded those services back to Great Northern,
>> because five years on, there's no sign of them ever running through the
>> core, as originally planned.
>
>The 379s will be used on GN services, so the 700s can be returned to TL.

The 700's are already with TL. What I said was: they should re-brand
those trains which terminate at Kings Cross (which were originally
supposed to go through the core once they'd got the signalling working
to spec) as GN.

And hopefully *then* find some extra Electrostars to operate them.

Electrostars on GN are already a mess, with some still half-liveried as
Gatwick Express. http://www.perry.co.uk/images/ex-Gatex.jpg (photo from
2021)

And the rest a random mixture of no-livery and dark green. They don't
even seem to be able to pair up two green ones or two red ones.
--
Roland Perry

On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 13:15:02 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:

>In message <mHNTN.28672$jC2.6737@fx06.ams1>, at 10:41:22 on Wed, 17 Apr
>2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <uvmh8j$13du0$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:49:55 on Tue, 16 Apr
>>> 2024, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:
>>>
>>>> there would be howls from people with nowhere to put their laptops.
>>>
>>> I was on a Thameslink 700 last week for over an hour (it was pretty much
>>> "all shacks" to Kings Cross) and very surprised to find neither power
>>> sockets nor tables/seat-back-trays for my laptop.
>>>
>>> It's about time they rebranded those services back to Great Northern,
>>> because five years on, there's no sign of them ever running through the
>>> core, as originally planned.
>>
>>The 379s will be used on GN services, so the 700s can be returned to TL.
>
>The 700's are already with TL. What I said was: they should re-brand
>those trains which terminate at Kings Cross (which were originally
>supposed to go through the core once they'd got the signalling working
>to spec) as GN.

I don't think the 700s will be regularly working on GN routes in the future.

>
>And hopefully *then* find some extra Electrostars to operate them.

There's no need to 'find' any — they have the 379s.

>
>Electrostars on GN are already a mess, with some still half-liveried as
>Gatwick Express. http://www.perry.co.uk/images/ex-Gatex.jpg (photo from
>2021)
>
>And the rest a random mixture of no-livery and dark green. They don't
>even seem to be able to pair up two green ones or two red ones.

Haven't all the 387s moved back to GX by now?

In message <95qv1jtc8grhe9ed3sb9em9sfe90q1m45r@4ax.com>, at 16:24:00 on
Wed, 17 Apr 2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 13:15:02 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>
>>In message <mHNTN.28672$jC2.6737@fx06.ams1>, at 10:41:22 on Wed, 17 Apr
>>2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>>> In message <uvmh8j$13du0$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:49:55 on Tue, 16 Apr
>>>> 2024, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:
>>>>
>>>>> there would be howls from people with nowhere to put their laptops.
>>>>
>>>> I was on a Thameslink 700 last week for over an hour (it was pretty much
>>>> "all shacks" to Kings Cross) and very surprised to find neither power
>>>> sockets nor tables/seat-back-trays for my laptop.
>>>>
>>>> It's about time they rebranded those services back to Great Northern,
>>>> because five years on, there's no sign of them ever running through the
>>>> core, as originally planned.
>>>
>>>The 379s will be used on GN services, so the 700s can be returned to TL.
>>
>>The 700's are already with TL. What I said was: they should re-brand
>>those trains which terminate at Kings Cross (which were originally
>>supposed to go through the core once they'd got the signalling working
>>to spec) as GN.
>
>I don't think the 700s will be regularly working on GN routes in the future.

Still completely missing the point.

The 700's in question are on ***THAMESLINK*** routes that just happen to
be permanently north of the river, and which I'm suggesting should be
***REBRANDED*** as GN, because that's what they used to be, before they
got transferred to Thameslink (but still "temporarily" terminating at
Kings Cross) awaiting the signalling in the core to work properly. Which
five years later, there's no sign of.

>>And hopefully *then* find some extra Electrostars to operate them.
>
>There's no need to 'find' any — they have the 379s.

Enough to substitute the Kings Cross to Cambridge all-shacks service?

They also run at least one 700 on a mid-morning Kings Lynn to Kings
Cross express, and why they do that if they have sufficient
Electrostars?

>>Electrostars on GN are already a mess, with some still half-liveried as
>>Gatwick Express. http://www.perry.co.uk/images/ex-Gatex.jpg (photo from
>>2021)
>>
>>And the rest a random mixture of no-livery and dark green. They don't
>>even seem to be able to pair up two green ones or two red ones.
>
>Haven't all the

Red liveried?

>387s moved back to GX by now?

No, I saw one only the other day. Then there's the green ex-GWR
Electrostars.
--
Roland Perry

On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 17:00:28 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:

>In message <95qv1jtc8grhe9ed3sb9em9sfe90q1m45r@4ax.com>, at 16:24:00 on
>Wed, 17 Apr 2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 13:15:02 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>
>>>In message <mHNTN.28672$jC2.6737@fx06.ams1>, at 10:41:22 on Wed, 17 Apr
>>>2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>>>> In message <uvmh8j$13du0$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:49:55 on Tue, 16 Apr
>>>>> 2024, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:
>>>>>
>>>>>> there would be howls from people with nowhere to put their laptops.
>>>>>
>>>>> I was on a Thameslink 700 last week for over an hour (it was pretty much
>>>>> "all shacks" to Kings Cross) and very surprised to find neither power
>>>>> sockets nor tables/seat-back-trays for my laptop.
>>>>>
>>>>> It's about time they rebranded those services back to Great Northern,
>>>>> because five years on, there's no sign of them ever running through the
>>>>> core, as originally planned.
>>>>
>>>>The 379s will be used on GN services, so the 700s can be returned to TL.
>>>
>>>The 700's are already with TL. What I said was: they should re-brand
>>>those trains which terminate at Kings Cross (which were originally
>>>supposed to go through the core once they'd got the signalling working
>>>to spec) as GN.
>>
>>I don't think the 700s will be regularly working on GN routes in the future.
>
>Still completely missing the point.
>
>The 700's in question are on ***THAMESLINK*** routes that just happen to
>be permanently north of the river, and which I'm suggesting should be
>***REBRANDED*** as GN, because that's what they used to be, before they
>got transferred to Thameslink (but still "temporarily" terminating at
>Kings Cross) awaiting the signalling in the core to work properly. Which
>five years later, there's no sign of.
>
>>>And hopefully *then* find some extra Electrostars to operate them.
>>
>>There's no need to 'find' any — they have the 379s.
>
>Enough to substitute the Kings Cross to Cambridge all-shacks service?
>
>They also run at least one 700 on a mid-morning Kings Lynn to Kings
>Cross express, and why they do that if they have sufficient
>Electrostars?

The 379 procurement is new news. They'll be getting all 30x4 units. How many (8-car?) trains are needed on the stopping
services you mention?

>
>>>Electrostars on GN are already a mess, with some still half-liveried as
>>>Gatwick Express. http://www.perry.co.uk/images/ex-Gatex.jpg (photo from
>>>2021)
>>>
>>>And the rest a random mixture of no-livery and dark green. They don't
>>>even seem to be able to pair up two green ones or two red ones.
>>
>>Haven't all the
>
>Red liveried?
>
>>387s moved back to GX by now?
>
>No, I saw one only the other day. Then there's the green ex-GWR
>Electrostars.

I guess they're covering for the withdrawal of the 365s. I wonder if they'll still be needed, when the 379s arrive?

In message <gu002jtdgd0mribn1bdr5jeajq70n8837c@4ax.com>, at 18:22:33 on
Wed, 17 Apr 2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 17:00:28 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>
>>In message <95qv1jtc8grhe9ed3sb9em9sfe90q1m45r@4ax.com>, at 16:24:00 on
>>Wed, 17 Apr 2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 13:15:02 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>>
>>>>In message <mHNTN.28672$jC2.6737@fx06.ams1>, at 10:41:22 on Wed, 17 Apr
>>>>2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>>>>> In message <uvmh8j$13du0$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:49:55 on Tue, 16 Apr
>>>>>> 2024, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> there would be howls from people with nowhere to put their laptops.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I was on a Thameslink 700 last week for over an hour (it was pretty much
>>>>>> "all shacks" to Kings Cross) and very surprised to find neither power
>>>>>> sockets nor tables/seat-back-trays for my laptop.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> It's about time they rebranded those services back to Great Northern,
>>>>>> because five years on, there's no sign of them ever running through the
>>>>>> core, as originally planned.
>>>>>
>>>>>The 379s will be used on GN services, so the 700s can be returned to TL.
>>>>
>>>>The 700's are already with TL. What I said was: they should re-brand
>>>>those trains which terminate at Kings Cross (which were originally
>>>>supposed to go through the core once they'd got the signalling working
>>>>to spec) as GN.
>>>
>>>I don't think the 700s will be regularly working on GN routes in the future.
>>
>>Still completely missing the point.
>>
>>The 700's in question are on ***THAMESLINK*** routes that just happen to
>>be permanently north of the river, and which I'm suggesting should be
>>***REBRANDED*** as GN, because that's what they used to be, before they
>>got transferred to Thameslink (but still "temporarily" terminating at
>>Kings Cross) awaiting the signalling in the core to work properly. Which
>>five years later, there's no sign of.
>>
>>>>And hopefully *then* find some extra Electrostars to operate them.
>>>
>>>There's no need to 'find' any — they have the 379s.
>>
>>Enough to substitute the Kings Cross to Cambridge all-shacks service?
>>
>>They also run at least one 700 on a mid-morning Kings Lynn to Kings
>>Cross express, and why they do that if they have sufficient
>>Electrostars?
>
>The 379 procurement is new news. They'll be getting all 30x4 units. How
>many (8-car?) trains are needed on the stopping services you mention?

The basic data is 2tph, 1hr25mins each way.

>>>>Electrostars on GN are already a mess, with some still half-liveried as
>>>>Gatwick Express. http://www.perry.co.uk/images/ex-Gatex.jpg (photo from
>>>>2021)
>>>>
>>>>And the rest a random mixture of no-livery and dark green. They don't
>>>>even seem to be able to pair up two green ones or two red ones.
>>>
>>>Haven't all the
>>
>>Red liveried?
>>
>>>387s moved back to GX by now?
>>
>>No, I saw one only the other day. Then there's the green ex-GWR
>>Electrostars.
>
>I guess they're covering for the withdrawal of the 365s.

That was ages ago.

>I wonder if they'll still be needed, when the 379s arrive?

Who knows. Will they still be branded "Stansted Express"?
--
Roland Perry

On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 20:30:33 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:

>In message <gu002jtdgd0mribn1bdr5jeajq70n8837c@4ax.com>, at 18:22:33 on
>Wed, 17 Apr 2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 17:00:28 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>
>>>In message <95qv1jtc8grhe9ed3sb9em9sfe90q1m45r@4ax.com>, at 16:24:00 on
>>>Wed, 17 Apr 2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 13:15:02 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>In message <mHNTN.28672$jC2.6737@fx06.ams1>, at 10:41:22 on Wed, 17 Apr
>>>>>2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>> In message <uvmh8j$13du0$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:49:55 on Tue, 16 Apr
>>>>>>> 2024, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> there would be howls from people with nowhere to put their laptops.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I was on a Thameslink 700 last week for over an hour (it was pretty much
>>>>>>> "all shacks" to Kings Cross) and very surprised to find neither power
>>>>>>> sockets nor tables/seat-back-trays for my laptop.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> It's about time they rebranded those services back to Great Northern,
>>>>>>> because five years on, there's no sign of them ever running through the
>>>>>>> core, as originally planned.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>The 379s will be used on GN services, so the 700s can be returned to TL.
>>>>>
>>>>>The 700's are already with TL. What I said was: they should re-brand
>>>>>those trains which terminate at Kings Cross (which were originally
>>>>>supposed to go through the core once they'd got the signalling working
>>>>>to spec) as GN.
>>>>
>>>>I don't think the 700s will be regularly working on GN routes in the future.
>>>
>>>Still completely missing the point.
>>>
>>>The 700's in question are on ***THAMESLINK*** routes that just happen to
>>>be permanently north of the river, and which I'm suggesting should be
>>>***REBRANDED*** as GN, because that's what they used to be, before they
>>>got transferred to Thameslink (but still "temporarily" terminating at
>>>Kings Cross) awaiting the signalling in the core to work properly. Which
>>>five years later, there's no sign of.
>>>
>>>>>And hopefully *then* find some extra Electrostars to operate them.
>>>>
>>>>There's no need to 'find' any — they have the 379s.
>>>
>>>Enough to substitute the Kings Cross to Cambridge all-shacks service?
>>>
>>>They also run at least one 700 on a mid-morning Kings Lynn to Kings
>>>Cross express, and why they do that if they have sufficient
>>>Electrostars?
>>
>>The 379 procurement is new news. They'll be getting all 30x4 units. How
>>many (8-car?) trains are needed on the stopping services you mention?
>
>The basic data is 2tph, 1hr25mins each way.
>
>>>>>Electrostars on GN are already a mess, with some still half-liveried as
>>>>>Gatwick Express. http://www.perry.co.uk/images/ex-Gatex.jpg (photo from
>>>>>2021)
>>>>>
>>>>>And the rest a random mixture of no-livery and dark green. They don't
>>>>>even seem to be able to pair up two green ones or two red ones.
>>>>
>>>>Haven't all the
>>>
>>>Red liveried?
>>>
>>>>387s moved back to GX by now?
>>>
>>>No, I saw one only the other day. Then there's the green ex-GWR
>>>Electrostars.
>>
>>I guess they're covering for the withdrawal of the 365s.
>
>That was ages ago.

Yes, but the 365s hadn't been replaced till now, hence the need for cover.

>
>>I wonder if they'll still be needed, when the 379s arrive?
>
>Who knows. Will they still be branded "Stansted Express"?

That would be too confusing, so I assume they'll use the simple GN livery.

In message <ks902jlt263q0v3ag7v0gqcs4konrugrkl@4ax.com>, at 20:50:31 on
Wed, 17 Apr 2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 20:30:33 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>
>>In message <gu002jtdgd0mribn1bdr5jeajq70n8837c@4ax.com>, at 18:22:33 on
>>Wed, 17 Apr 2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 17:00:28 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>>
>>>>In message <95qv1jtc8grhe9ed3sb9em9sfe90q1m45r@4ax.com>, at 16:24:00 on
>>>>Wed, 17 Apr 2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 13:15:02 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>In message <mHNTN.28672$jC2.6737@fx06.ams1>, at 10:41:22 on Wed, 17 Apr
>>>>>>2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:

>>>>>>>> In message <uvmh8j$13du0$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:49:55 on Tue, 16 Apr
>>>>>>>> 2024, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> there would be howls from people with nowhere to put their laptops.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I was on a Thameslink 700 last week for over an hour (it was
>>>>>>>>pretty much "all shacks" to Kings Cross) and very surprised to
>>>>>>>>find neither power sockets nor tables/seat-back-trays for my laptop.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> It's about time they rebranded those services back to Great Northern,
>>>>>>>> because five years on, there's no sign of them ever running through the
>>>>>>>> core, as originally planned.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>The 379s will be used on GN services, so the 700s can be returned to TL.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>The 700's are already with TL. What I said was: they should re-brand
>>>>>>those trains which terminate at Kings Cross (which were originally
>>>>>>supposed to go through the core once they'd got the signalling working
>>>>>>to spec) as GN.
>>>>>
>>>>>I don't think the 700s will be regularly working on GN routes in
>>>>>the future.
>>>>
>>>>Still completely missing the point.
>>>>
>>>>The 700's in question are on ***THAMESLINK*** routes that just happen to
>>>>be permanently north of the river, and which I'm suggesting should be
>>>>***REBRANDED*** as GN, because that's what they used to be, before they
>>>>got transferred to Thameslink (but still "temporarily" terminating at
>>>>Kings Cross) awaiting the signalling in the core to work properly. Which
>>>>five years later, there's no sign of.
>>>>
>>>>>>And hopefully *then* find some extra Electrostars to operate them.
>>>>>
>>>>>There's no need to 'find' any — they have the 379s.
>>>>
>>>>Enough to substitute the Kings Cross to Cambridge all-shacks service?
>>>>
>>>>They also run at least one 700 on a mid-morning Kings Lynn to Kings
>>>>Cross express, and why they do that if they have sufficient
>>>>Electrostars?
>>>
>>>The 379 procurement is new news. They'll be getting all 30x4 units. How
>>>many (8-car?) trains are needed on the stopping services you mention?
>>
>>The basic data is 2tph, 1hr25mins each way.
>>
>>>>>>Electrostars on GN are already a mess, with some still half-liveried as
>>>>>>Gatwick Express. http://www.perry.co.uk/images/ex-Gatex.jpg (photo from
>>>>>>2021)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>And the rest a random mixture of no-livery and dark green. They don't
>>>>>>even seem to be able to pair up two green ones or two red ones.
>>>>>
>>>>>Haven't all the
>>>>
>>>>Red liveried?
>>>>
>>>>>387s moved back to GX by now?
>>>>
>>>>No, I saw one only the other day. Then there's the green ex-GWR
>>>>Electrostars.
>>>
>>>I guess they're covering for the withdrawal of the 365s.
>>
>>That was ages ago.
>
>Yes, but the 365s hadn't been replaced till now, hence the need for cover.

The 365s were withdrawn three years ago (almost exactly).

>>>I wonder if they'll still be needed, when the 379s arrive?
>>
>>Who knows. Will they still be branded "Stansted Express"?
>
>That would be too confusing, so I assume they'll use the simple GN livery.

The precedent is not to remove anything that's painted on them, hence
the red Electrostars still having Gatwick Express lettering on.
--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
> In message <ks902jlt263q0v3ag7v0gqcs4konrugrkl@4ax.com>, at 20:50:31 on
> Wed, 17 Apr 2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>> On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 20:30:33 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>
>>> In message <gu002jtdgd0mribn1bdr5jeajq70n8837c@4ax.com>, at 18:22:33 on
>>> Wed, 17 Apr 2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>> On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 17:00:28 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> In message <95qv1jtc8grhe9ed3sb9em9sfe90q1m45r@4ax.com>, at 16:24:00 on
>>>>> Wed, 17 Apr 2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>> On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 13:15:02 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In message <mHNTN.28672$jC2.6737@fx06.ams1>, at 10:41:22 on Wed, 17 Apr
>>>>>>> 2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>
>>>>>>>>> In message <uvmh8j$13du0$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:49:55 on Tue, 16 Apr
>>>>>>>>> 2024, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> there would be howls from people with nowhere to put their laptops.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I was on a Thameslink 700 last week for over an hour (it was
>>>>>>>>> pretty much "all shacks" to Kings Cross) and very surprised to
>>>>>>>>> find neither power sockets nor tables/seat-back-trays for my laptop.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> It's about time they rebranded those services back to Great Northern,
>>>>>>>>> because five years on, there's no sign of them ever running through the
>>>>>>>>> core, as originally planned.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The 379s will be used on GN services, so the 700s can be returned to TL.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The 700's are already with TL. What I said was: they should re-brand
>>>>>>> those trains which terminate at Kings Cross (which were originally
>>>>>>> supposed to go through the core once they'd got the signalling working
>>>>>>> to spec) as GN.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I don't think the 700s will be regularly working on GN routes in
>>>>>> the future.
>>>>>
>>>>> Still completely missing the point.
>>>>>
>>>>> The 700's in question are on ***THAMESLINK*** routes that just happen to
>>>>> be permanently north of the river, and which I'm suggesting should be
>>>>> ***REBRANDED*** as GN, because that's what they used to be, before they
>>>>> got transferred to Thameslink (but still "temporarily" terminating at
>>>>> Kings Cross) awaiting the signalling in the core to work properly. Which
>>>>> five years later, there's no sign of.
>>>>>
>>>>>>> And hopefully *then* find some extra Electrostars to operate them.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> There's no need to 'find' any — they have the 379s.
>>>>>
>>>>> Enough to substitute the Kings Cross to Cambridge all-shacks service?
>>>>>
>>>>> They also run at least one 700 on a mid-morning Kings Lynn to Kings
>>>>> Cross express, and why they do that if they have sufficient
>>>>> Electrostars?
>>>>
>>>> The 379 procurement is new news. They'll be getting all 30x4 units. How
>>>> many (8-car?) trains are needed on the stopping services you mention?
>>>
>>> The basic data is 2tph, 1hr25mins each way.
>>>
>>>>>>> Electrostars on GN are already a mess, with some still half-liveried as
>>>>>>> Gatwick Express. http://www.perry.co.uk/images/ex-Gatex.jpg (photo from
>>>>>>> 2021)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And the rest a random mixture of no-livery and dark green. They don't
>>>>>>> even seem to be able to pair up two green ones or two red ones.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Haven't all the
>>>>>
>>>>> Red liveried?
>>>>>
>>>>>> 387s moved back to GX by now?
>>>>>
>>>>> No, I saw one only the other day. Then there's the green ex-GWR
>>>>> Electrostars.
>>>>
>>>> I guess they're covering for the withdrawal of the 365s.
>>>
>>> That was ages ago.
>>
>> Yes, but the 365s hadn't been replaced till now, hence the need for cover.
>
> The 365s were withdrawn three years ago (almost exactly).

Yes, and that's during the time when spare GX units were available.

>
>>>> I wonder if they'll still be needed, when the 379s arrive?
>>>
>>> Who knows. Will they still be branded "Stansted Express"?
>>
>> That would be too confusing, so I assume they'll use the simple GN livery.
>
> The precedent is not to remove anything that's painted on them, hence
> the red Electrostars still having Gatwick Express lettering on.

They were always intended to return to GX, once services fully resumed (ie,
4tph).

In message <WW4UN.69065$lu2.68310@fx15.ams1>, at 08:35:02 on Thu, 18 Apr
2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>> In message <ks902jlt263q0v3ag7v0gqcs4konrugrkl@4ax.com>, at 20:50:31 on
>> Wed, 17 Apr 2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>> On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 20:30:33 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>>
>>>> In message <gu002jtdgd0mribn1bdr5jeajq70n8837c@4ax.com>, at 18:22:33 on
>>>> Wed, 17 Apr 2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>> On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 17:00:28 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> In message <95qv1jtc8grhe9ed3sb9em9sfe90q1m45r@4ax.com>, at 16:24:00 on
>>>>>> Wed, 17 Apr 2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>> On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 13:15:02 +0100, Roland Perry
>>>>>>><roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> In message <mHNTN.28672$jC2.6737@fx06.ams1>, at 10:41:22 on Wed, 17 Apr
>>>>>>>> 2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>
>>>>>>>>>> In message <uvmh8j$13du0$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:49:55 on Tue, 16 Apr
>>>>>>>>>> 2024, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> there would be howls from people with nowhere to put their laptops.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I was on a Thameslink 700 last week for over an hour (it was
>>>>>>>>>> pretty much "all shacks" to Kings Cross) and very surprised to
>>>>>>>>>> find neither power sockets nor tables/seat-back-trays for my laptop.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> It's about time they rebranded those services back to Great Northern,
>>>>>>>>>> because five years on, there's no sign of them ever running
>>>>>>>>>>through the
>>>>>>>>>> core, as originally planned.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The 379s will be used on GN services, so the 700s can be
>>>>>>>>>returned to TL.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The 700's are already with TL. What I said was: they should re-brand
>>>>>>>> those trains which terminate at Kings Cross (which were originally
>>>>>>>> supposed to go through the core once they'd got the signalling working
>>>>>>>> to spec) as GN.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I don't think the 700s will be regularly working on GN routes in
>>>>>>> the future.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Still completely missing the point.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The 700's in question are on ***THAMESLINK*** routes that just happen to
>>>>>> be permanently north of the river, and which I'm suggesting should be
>>>>>> ***REBRANDED*** as GN, because that's what they used to be, before they
>>>>>> got transferred to Thameslink (but still "temporarily" terminating at
>>>>>> Kings Cross) awaiting the signalling in the core to work properly. Which
>>>>>> five years later, there's no sign of.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And hopefully *then* find some extra Electrostars to operate them.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> There's no need to 'find' any — they have the 379s.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Enough to substitute the Kings Cross to Cambridge all-shacks service?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> They also run at least one 700 on a mid-morning Kings Lynn to Kings
>>>>>> Cross express, and why they do that if they have sufficient
>>>>>> Electrostars?
>>>>>
>>>>> The 379 procurement is new news. They'll be getting all 30x4 units. How
>>>>> many (8-car?) trains are needed on the stopping services you mention?
>>>>
>>>> The basic data is 2tph, 1hr25mins each way.
>>>>
>>>>>>>> Electrostars on GN are already a mess, with some still half-liveried as
>>>>>>>> Gatwick Express. http://www.perry.co.uk/images/ex-Gatex.jpg (photo from
>>>>>>>> 2021)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> And the rest a random mixture of no-livery and dark green. They don't
>>>>>>>> even seem to be able to pair up two green ones or two red ones.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Haven't all the
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Red liveried?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 387s moved back to GX by now?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> No, I saw one only the other day. Then there's the green ex-GWR
>>>>>> Electrostars.
>>>>>
>>>>> I guess they're covering for the withdrawal of the 365s.
>>>>
>>>> That was ages ago.
>>>
>>> Yes, but the 365s hadn't been replaced till now, hence the need for cover.
>>
>> The 365s were withdrawn three years ago (almost exactly).
>
>Yes, and that's during the time when spare GX units were available.

They still seem to be available (plus some GWR ones as well).

>>>>> I wonder if they'll still be needed, when the 379s arrive?
>>>>
>>>> Who knows. Will they still be branded "Stansted Express"?
>>>
>>> That would be too confusing, so I assume they'll use the simple GN livery.
>>
>> The precedent is not to remove anything that's painted on them, hence
>> the red Electrostars still having Gatwick Express lettering on.
>
>They were always intended to return to GX, once services fully resumed (ie,
>4tph).

Do we know when that's likely?
--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
> In message <WW4UN.69065$lu2.68310@fx15.ams1>, at 08:35:02 on Thu, 18 Apr
> 2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>> In message <ks902jlt263q0v3ag7v0gqcs4konrugrkl@4ax.com>, at 20:50:31 on
>>> Wed, 17 Apr 2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>> On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 20:30:33 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> In message <gu002jtdgd0mribn1bdr5jeajq70n8837c@4ax.com>, at 18:22:33 on
>>>>> Wed, 17 Apr 2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>> On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 17:00:28 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In message <95qv1jtc8grhe9ed3sb9em9sfe90q1m45r@4ax.com>, at 16:24:00 on
>>>>>>> Wed, 17 Apr 2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>> On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 13:15:02 +0100, Roland Perry
>>>>>>>> <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> In message <mHNTN.28672$jC2.6737@fx06.ams1>, at 10:41:22 on Wed, 17 Apr
>>>>>>>>> 2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:
>>>>>>>>>> Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk> wrote:
>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> In message <uvmh8j$13du0$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:49:55 on Tue, 16 Apr
>>>>>>>>>>> 2024, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> there would be howls from people with nowhere to put their laptops.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I was on a Thameslink 700 last week for over an hour (it was
>>>>>>>>>>> pretty much "all shacks" to Kings Cross) and very surprised to
>>>>>>>>>>> find neither power sockets nor tables/seat-back-trays for my laptop.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> It's about time they rebranded those services back to Great Northern,
>>>>>>>>>>> because five years on, there's no sign of them ever running
>>>>>>>>>>> through the
>>>>>>>>>>> core, as originally planned.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> The 379s will be used on GN services, so the 700s can be
>>>>>>>>>> returned to TL.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The 700's are already with TL. What I said was: they should re-brand
>>>>>>>>> those trains which terminate at Kings Cross (which were originally
>>>>>>>>> supposed to go through the core once they'd got the signalling working
>>>>>>>>> to spec) as GN.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I don't think the 700s will be regularly working on GN routes in
>>>>>>>> the future.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Still completely missing the point.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The 700's in question are on ***THAMESLINK*** routes that just happen to
>>>>>>> be permanently north of the river, and which I'm suggesting should be
>>>>>>> ***REBRANDED*** as GN, because that's what they used to be, before they
>>>>>>> got transferred to Thameslink (but still "temporarily" terminating at
>>>>>>> Kings Cross) awaiting the signalling in the core to work properly. Which
>>>>>>> five years later, there's no sign of.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> And hopefully *then* find some extra Electrostars to operate them.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> There's no need to 'find' any — they have the 379s.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Enough to substitute the Kings Cross to Cambridge all-shacks service?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> They also run at least one 700 on a mid-morning Kings Lynn to Kings
>>>>>>> Cross express, and why they do that if they have sufficient
>>>>>>> Electrostars?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The 379 procurement is new news. They'll be getting all 30x4 units. How
>>>>>> many (8-car?) trains are needed on the stopping services you mention?
>>>>>
>>>>> The basic data is 2tph, 1hr25mins each way.
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Electrostars on GN are already a mess, with some still half-liveried as
>>>>>>>>> Gatwick Express. http://www.perry.co.uk/images/ex-Gatex.jpg (photo from
>>>>>>>>> 2021)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> And the rest a random mixture of no-livery and dark green. They don't
>>>>>>>>> even seem to be able to pair up two green ones or two red ones.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Haven't all the
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Red liveried?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> 387s moved back to GX by now?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> No, I saw one only the other day. Then there's the green ex-GWR
>>>>>>> Electrostars.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I guess they're covering for the withdrawal of the 365s.
>>>>>
>>>>> That was ages ago.
>>>>
>>>> Yes, but the 365s hadn't been replaced till now, hence the need for cover.
>>>
>>> The 365s were withdrawn three years ago (almost exactly).
>>
>> Yes, and that's during the time when spare GX units were available.
>
> They still seem to be available (plus some GWR ones as well).

Yes, GX is still only running a 2tph service.

>
>>>>>> I wonder if they'll still be needed, when the 379s arrive?
>>>>>
>>>>> Who knows. Will they still be branded "Stansted Express"?
>>>>
>>>> That would be too confusing, so I assume they'll use the simple GN livery.
>>>
>>> The precedent is not to remove anything that's painted on them, hence
>>> the red Electrostars still having Gatwick Express lettering on.
>>
>> They were always intended to return to GX, once services fully resumed (ie,
>> 4tph).
>
> Do we know when that's likely?

I'm quite surprised it's not back up to 4tph by now.

On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 07:49:53 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk>
wrote:

>In message <uvmh8j$13du0$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:49:55 on Tue, 16 Apr
>2024, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:
>
>>there would be howls from people with nowhere to put their laptops.
>
>I was on a Thameslink 700 last week for over an hour (it was pretty much
>"all shacks" to Kings Cross) and very surprised to find neither power
>sockets nor tables/seat-back-trays for my laptop.
>
It is a train not an internet cafe.
<snip>

In message <e3s22j5v5ib5qnm407a27mpr2k5tqefcmu@4ax.com>, at 20:12:43 on
Thu, 18 Apr 2024, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
remarked:
>On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 07:49:53 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk>
>wrote:
>
>>In message <uvmh8j$13du0$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:49:55 on Tue, 16 Apr
>>2024, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:
>>
>>>there would be howls from people with nowhere to put their laptops.
>>
>>I was on a Thameslink 700 last week for over an hour (it was pretty much
>>"all shacks" to Kings Cross) and very surprised to find neither power
>>sockets nor tables/seat-back-trays for my laptop.
>>
>It is a train not an internet cafe.
><snip>

Except "working on the train" is supposed one of its big benefits. And
they do provide wifi (when it works). And talking of cafes, tables are
useful for food and drink as well.

On an hour and a half journey (and that's just from the centre to the
northern extremity, not end-to-end) it's ridiculous to provide such a
badly equipped train.
--
Roland Perry

In message <Ys5UN.28676$jC2.16929@fx06.ams1>, at 09:11:20 on Thu, 18 Apr
2024, Recliner <recliner.usenet@gmail.com> remarked:

[Newly recycled Electrostars on Kings Cross to Kings Lynn]

>>>>>>Will they still be branded "Stansted Express"?
>>>>>
>>>>> That would be too confusing, so I assume they'll use the simple GN livery.
>>>>
>>>> The precedent is not to remove anything that's painted on them, hence
>>>> the red Electrostars still having Gatwick Express lettering on.
>>>
>>> They were always intended to return to GX, once services fully resumed (ie,
>>> 4tph).
>>
>> Do we know when that's likely?
>
>I'm quite surprised it's not back up to 4tph by now.

"Can't get the red-liveried Electrostars, guv"
--
Roland Perry

On 19.04.2024 06:23, Roland Perry wrote:
> In message <e3s22j5v5ib5qnm407a27mpr2k5tqefcmu@4ax.com>, at 20:12:43 on
> Thu, 18 Apr 2024, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com> remarked:
>> On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 07:49:53 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> In message <uvmh8j$13du0$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:49:55 on Tue, 16 Apr
>>> 2024, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:
>>>
>>>> there would be howls from people with nowhere to put their laptops.
>>>
>>> I was on a Thameslink 700 last week for over an hour (it was pretty much
>>> "all shacks" to Kings Cross) and very surprised to find neither power
>>> sockets nor tables/seat-back-trays for my laptop.
>>>
>> It is a train not an internet cafe.
>> <snip>
>
> Except "working on the train" is supposed one of its big benefits. And
> they do provide wifi (when it works). And talking of cafes, tables are
> useful for food and drink as well.
>
> On an hour and a half journey (and that's just from the centre to the
> northern extremity, not end-to-end) it's ridiculous to provide such a
> badly equipped train.

I'd be interested to know what the actual usage of wifi on various forms
of public transport vehicles is. On the few occasions I have tried to
make use of it where it is claimed to be available (and where my device
is able to actually connect to it), I have found it to be essentially
unusuably slow as often as not, and sometimes claims to connect but
never actually delivers any data. Unless I had prior experience of
reliability, my default approach to getting internet on the move would
be to connect through my phone. I wonder how many other people take that
view, and even when it is available, just dont bother.

Robin

Bob <bob@domain.com> wrote:
> On 19.04.2024 06:23, Roland Perry wrote:
>> In message <e3s22j5v5ib5qnm407a27mpr2k5tqefcmu@4ax.com>, at 20:12:43 on
>> Thu, 18 Apr 2024, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com> remarked:
>>> On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 07:49:53 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> In message <uvmh8j$13du0$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:49:55 on Tue, 16 Apr
>>>> 2024, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:
>>>>
>>>>> there would be howls from people with nowhere to put their laptops.
>>>>
>>>> I was on a Thameslink 700 last week for over an hour (it was pretty much
>>>> "all shacks" to Kings Cross) and very surprised to find neither power
>>>> sockets nor tables/seat-back-trays for my laptop.
>>>>
>>> It is a train not an internet cafe.
>>> <snip>
>>
>> Except "working on the train" is supposed one of its big benefits. And
>> they do provide wifi (when it works). And talking of cafes, tables are
>> useful for food and drink as well.
>>
>> On an hour and a half journey (and that's just from the centre to the
>> northern extremity, not end-to-end) it's ridiculous to provide such a
>> badly equipped train.
>
> I'd be interested to know what the actual usage of wifi on various forms
> of public transport vehicles is. On the few occasions I have tried to
> make use of it where it is claimed to be available (and where my device
> is able to actually connect to it), I have found it to be essentially
> unusuably slow as often as not, and sometimes claims to connect but
> never actually delivers any data. Unless I had prior experience of
> reliability, my default approach to getting internet on the move would
> be to connect through my phone. I wonder how many other people take that
> view, and even when it is available, just dont bother.
>
> Robin
>

I largely have your experience and try to use my own phone where possible.
It would be better these days if trains were fitted with cellular repeater
systems to take advantage of better antenna positioning (and multi antenna
diversity if you are being posh) and leave the data bit down to the
responsibility of the passenger. It is, for example, what is implemented on
the Munich underground.

On 19/04/2024 07:52, Bob wrote:
> I'd be interested to know what the actual usage of wifi on various forms
> of public transport vehicles is. On the few occasions I have tried to
> make use of it where it is claimed to be available (and where my device
> is able to actually connect to it), I have found it to be essentially
> unusuably slow as often as not, and sometimes claims to connect but
> never actually delivers any data. Unless I had prior experience of
> reliability, my default approach to getting internet on the move would
> be to connect through my phone. I wonder how many other people take that
> view, and even when it is available, just dont bother.

I've found that SWR station wifi is useful, reasonably quick access and
speeds, but the on-train version suffers from the problems you mention.

I got a good connection on a bus the other day, only to discover, as we
left the stop, I was connected to the bus next door! My bus didn't have
wifi operating.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

On 19/04/2024 07:52, Bob wrote:
> On 19.04.2024 06:23, Roland Perry wrote:
>> In message <e3s22j5v5ib5qnm407a27mpr2k5tqefcmu@4ax.com>, at 20:12:43
>> on Thu, 18 Apr 2024, Charles Ellson <charlesellson@btinternet.com>
>> remarked:
>>> On Wed, 17 Apr 2024 07:49:53 +0100, Roland Perry <roland@perry.uk>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> In message <uvmh8j$13du0$1@dont-email.me>, at 19:49:55 on Tue, 16 Apr
>>>> 2024, Graeme Wall <rail@greywall.demon.co.uk> remarked:
>>>>
>>>>> there would be howls from people with nowhere to put their laptops.
>>>>
>>>> I was on a Thameslink 700 last week for over an hour (it was pretty
>>>> much
>>>> "all shacks" to Kings Cross) and very surprised to find neither power
>>>> sockets nor tables/seat-back-trays for my laptop.
>>>>
>>> It is a train not an internet cafe.
>>> <snip>
>>
>> Except "working on the train" is supposed one of its big benefits. And
>> they do provide wifi (when it works). And talking of cafes, tables are
>> useful for food and drink as well.
>>g
>> On an hour and a half journey (and that's just from the centre to the
>> northern extremity, not end-to-end) it's ridiculous to provide such a
>> badly equipped train.
>
> I'd be interested to know what the actual usage of wifi on various forms
> of public transport vehicles is. On the few occasions I have tried to
> make use of it where it is claimed to be available (and where my device
> is able to actually connect to it), I have found it to be essentially
> unusuably slow as often as not, and sometimes claims to connect but
> never actually delivers any data. Unless I had prior experience of
The majority of my travel greater than one hour is
> reliability, my default approach to getting internet on the move would
> be to connect through my phone. I wonder how many other people take that
> view, and even when it is available, just dont bother.
>

The majority of my travel greater than one hour is on routes with
non-existent mobile coverage for significant parts of the journeys.