but where are they going to live, with the housing crisis
put a bunk bed in the workshop?

On 5/3/2024 11:50 am, Nomen Nescio wrote:
> but where are they going to live, with the housing crisis
> put a bunk bed in the workshop?
>
Nothing new here. The mining industry is already importing motor
mechanics from OS, specifially China, for work in the mining industry.
China has been sending *tradesmen* abroad for yonks to work on belt and
road projects and now, with some Australian mining companies *owned* by
Chinese, they are being brought in by the hundreds to work on these
remote projects. Because they are remote, the average Aussie never sees
them.

I have been saying for some time now that current motor mechanics in
this country need to retrained, reskilled and *licenced* in hybrid, PHEV
and BEV vehicles because of the high voltages (200V - 800V AC/DC)
involved. We have enough *fake* motor mechanics (hello Darren!) as it
is, fakes who pretend they are trained and qualified, fakes who claim
skills and qualifications they do not possess.

Australia needs to make trades attractive to potential apprentices as
well as providing broader and better training along with *licencing* to
keep the shonks out.

--
Xeno

Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
(with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)

On 5/3/2024 11:50 am, Nomen Nescio wrote:
> but where are they going to live, with the housing crisis
> put a bunk bed in the workshop?
>
LOL, I read the article in the news yesterday about the EV mechanic
shortage which doesn't surprise me at all, my friends have to drive 20km
to get their PHEV Hyundai serviced because no one locally (even the
dealer that sold the car) is qualified to service it.
The crash repair industry is having huge problems getting anyone to
repair crashed EV's, some won't touch them because they think they are
too dangerous making the problem even worse.
EV body parts supply is also big problem apparently.
--
Daryl

On 6/3/2024 8:43 am, Daryl wrote:
> On 5/3/2024 11:50 am, Nomen Nescio wrote:
>> but where are they going to live, with the housing crisis
>> put a bunk bed in the workshop?
>>
> LOL, I read the article in the news yesterday about the EV mechanic
> shortage which doesn't surprise me at all, my friends have to drive 20km
> to get their PHEV Hyundai serviced because no one locally (even the
> dealer that sold the car) is qualified to service it.

That's because, in Victoria, any shonk can call themselves a mechanic -
with or without any training or assessment - but high voltage electrical
systems require appropriate *training* and *licencing*.

> The crash repair industry is having huge problems getting anyone to
> repair crashed EV's, some won't touch them because they think they are
> too dangerous making the problem even worse.

They are dangerous when you have unqualified shonks, like Darren,
working on them. Proper training, and effective use of said training,
minimises risks.

> EV body parts supply is also big problem apparently.

--
Xeno

Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
(with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)

On 5/03/2024 12:27 pm, Xeno wrote:
> On 5/3/2024 11:50 am, Nomen Nescio wrote:
>> but where are they going to live, with the housing crisis
>> put a bunk bed in the workshop?
>>
> Nothing new here. The mining industry is already importing motor
> mechanics from OS, specifially China, for work in the mining industry.
> China has been sending *tradesmen* abroad for yonks to work on belt and
> road projects and now, with some Australian mining companies *owned* by
> Chinese, they are being brought in by the hundreds to work on these
> remote projects. Because they are remote, the average Aussie never sees
> them.
>
> I have been saying for some time now that current motor mechanics in
> this country need to retrained, reskilled and *licenced* in hybrid, PHEV
> and BEV vehicles because of the high voltages (200V - 800V AC/DC)
> involved. We have enough *fake* motor mechanics (hello Darren!) as it
> is, fakes who pretend they are trained and qualified, fakes who claim
> skills and qualifications they do not possess.
>
> Australia needs to make trades attractive to potential apprentices as
> well as providing broader and better training along with *licencing* to
> keep the shonks out.
>

**Agreed. Modern cars have been getting more and more complex, requiring
far higher levels of skill and knowledge of mechanics. My own mechanic
tells me that there is a huge shortage of decent mechanics. He lost one
of his guys and has had a hard time finding a quality replacement.

--
This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
www.avast.com

On 6/03/2024 8:43 am, Daryl wrote:
> On 5/3/2024 11:50 am, Nomen Nescio wrote:
>> but where are they going to live, with the housing crisis
>> put a bunk bed in the workshop?
>>
> LOL, I read the article in the news yesterday about the EV mechanic
> shortage which doesn't surprise me at all, my friends have to drive 20km
> to get their PHEV Hyundai serviced because no one locally (even the
> dealer that sold the car) is qualified to service it.

ROTFL :) What a fuck up :)

You'd think the manufacturer would have organised in house training
*before* granting dealerships approval to sell the fucking things.

Hahahahaah :)

> The crash repair industry is having huge problems getting anyone to
> repair crashed EV's, some won't touch them because they think they are
> too dangerous making the problem even worse.
> EV body parts supply is also big problem apparently.

If only someone could explain how buying an EV makes any kind of sense....

--
--
--
Regards,
Noddy.

On 6/03/2024 11:56 am, Trevor Wilson wrote:

> **Agreed. Modern cars have been getting more and more complex, requiring
> far higher levels of skill and knowledge of mechanics.

What a shame we're not getting it. You can use the previous comments of
the nonsense that's gone on around here as proof of that. A trade
teacher who doesn't understand basic brake systems, or a "licensed
technician" who can't tell the difference between glass and plastic, and
who thinks random OBD2 data can be retrieved weeks later.

If chest beating clowns like this are any example, it's no wonder we're
going down the gurgler :)
> My own mechanic tells me that there is a huge shortage of decent
mechanics. He lost one
> of his guys and has had a hard time finding a quality replacement.

Very few people these days want to do the job, and it's not just
mechanics. Trades all across the board are suffering from a lack of
interested parties. Exactly why that is I can't tell you, but there is a
distinct pattern of trade applicants on a downward spiral.

--
--
--
Regards,
Noddy.

On 6/3/2024 1:29 pm, Noddy wrote:
> On 6/03/2024 11:56 am, Trevor Wilson wrote:
>
>> **Agreed. Modern cars have been getting more and more complex,
>> requiring far higher levels of skill and knowledge of mechanics.
>
> What a shame we're not getting it. You can use the previous comments of
> the nonsense that's gone on around here as proof of that. A trade
> teacher who doesn't understand basic brake systems, or a "licensed
> technician" who can't tell the difference between glass and plastic, and
> who thinks random OBD2 data can be retrieved weeks later.
>
>
> If chest beating clowns like this are any example, it's no wonder we're
> going down the gurgler :)

Says the fake mechanic who couldn't even *qualify* for any
apprenticeship ever. That's seriously rich! LOL

>  > My own mechanic tells me that there is a huge shortage of decent
> mechanics. He lost one
>> of his guys and has had a hard time finding a quality replacement.
>
> Very few people these days want to do the job, and it's not just
> mechanics. Trades all across the board are suffering from a lack of
> interested parties. Exactly why that is I can't tell you, but there is a
> distinct pattern of trade applicants on a downward spiral.

Of course you can't tell, you aren't relevant to any trade ever.

--
Xeno

Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
(with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)

On 6/03/2024 12:29 pm, Noddy wrote:
>
> Very few people these days want to do the job, and it's not just
> mechanics. Trades all across the board are suffering from a lack of
> interested parties. Exactly why that is I can't tell you, but there is a
> distinct pattern of trade applicants on a downward spiral.

One of my grandsons was training to be a surveyor. He was 6 months away
from getting his diploma, but had been waiting nearly 2 years for TAFE
to provide that last part so that he could qualify.

So he said bugger it to that, and now works for NSW education taking
kids on adventure courses. Actually, I think that he likes it better
than surveying.

On 6/03/2024 8:56 am, Trevor Wilson wrote:
> On 5/03/2024 12:27 pm, Xeno wrote:
>> On 5/3/2024 11:50 am, Nomen Nescio wrote:
>>> but where are they going to live, with the housing crisis
>>> put a bunk bed in the workshop?
>>>
>> Nothing new here. The mining industry is already importing motor
>> mechanics from OS, specifially China, for work in the mining industry.
>> China has been sending *tradesmen* abroad for yonks to work on belt
>> and road projects and now, with some Australian mining companies
>> *owned* by Chinese, they are being brought in by the hundreds to work
>> on these remote projects. Because they are remote, the average Aussie
>> never sees them.
>>
>> I have been saying for some time now that current motor mechanics in
>> this country need to retrained, reskilled and *licenced* in hybrid,
>> PHEV and BEV vehicles because of the high voltages (200V - 800V AC/DC)
>> involved. We have enough *fake* motor mechanics (hello Darren!) as it
>> is, fakes who pretend they are trained and qualified, fakes who claim
>> skills and qualifications they do not possess.
>>
>> Australia needs to make trades attractive to potential apprentices as
>> well as providing broader and better training along with *licencing*
>> to keep the shonks out.
>>
>
> **Agreed. Modern cars have been getting more and more complex, requiring
> far higher levels of skill and knowledge of mechanics. My own mechanic
> tells me that there is a huge shortage of decent mechanics. He lost one
> of his guys and has had a hard time finding a quality replacement.
>

Yep, but until backwards states like Victoria where pig-ignorant
incompetent and unqualified shonks who can't even use a diagnostic scan
tool to diagnose a simple fault (yes you Noddy) to operate there is
little chance of improving the situation there.

Other states are following WA and NSW's lead and licensing mechanics.

Another issue is that the mechanical trade is also becoming a highly
skilled multi-faceted one but the reward just isn't there. So there is
little incentive for mechanics to enter the trade or to stay in it once
they are.

Especially in Victoria where they are competing with noddies that have
no training, no experience, no qualifications and are grossly
incompetent that can charge the same as highly skilled, qualified and
highly competent technicians.

--
In thread "May need to buy petrol soon" Sept 23 2021 11:15:59am
Keithr0 wrote: "He made the assertion either he proves it or he is a
proven liar."

On Sept 23 2021 3:16:29pm Keithr0 wrote:
"He asserts that the claim is true, so, if it is unproven, he is lying."

On 6/3/2024 6:45 pm, Clocky wrote:
> On 6/03/2024 8:56 am, Trevor Wilson wrote:
>> On 5/03/2024 12:27 pm, Xeno wrote:
>>> On 5/3/2024 11:50 am, Nomen Nescio wrote:
>>>> but where are they going to live, with the housing crisis
>>>> put a bunk bed in the workshop?
>>>>
>>> Nothing new here. The mining industry is already importing motor
>>> mechanics from OS, specifially China, for work in the mining
>>> industry. China has been sending *tradesmen* abroad for yonks to work
>>> on belt and road projects and now, with some Australian mining
>>> companies *owned* by Chinese, they are being brought in by the
>>> hundreds to work on these remote projects. Because they are remote,
>>> the average Aussie never sees them.
>>>
>>> I have been saying for some time now that current motor mechanics in
>>> this country need to retrained, reskilled and *licenced* in hybrid,
>>> PHEV and BEV vehicles because of the high voltages (200V - 800V
>>> AC/DC) involved. We have enough *fake* motor mechanics (hello
>>> Darren!) as it is, fakes who pretend they are trained and qualified,
>>> fakes who claim skills and qualifications they do not possess.
>>>
>>> Australia needs to make trades attractive to potential apprentices as
>>> well as providing broader and better training along with *licencing*
>>> to keep the shonks out.
>>>
>>
>> **Agreed. Modern cars have been getting more and more complex,
>> requiring far higher levels of skill and knowledge of mechanics. My
>> own mechanic tells me that there is a huge shortage of decent
>> mechanics. He lost one of his guys and has had a hard time finding a
>> quality replacement.
>>
>
> Yep, but until backwards states like Victoria where pig-ignorant
> incompetent and unqualified shonks who can't even use a diagnostic scan
> tool to diagnose a simple fault (yes you Noddy) to operate there is
> little chance of improving the situation there.

There was a reason people like Darren couldn't enter into an
apprenticeship and it's quite simple - they didn't meet the *entry
level* into the trades. Don't meet that entry level, then there's no
guarantee of completing and passing the relevant trade subjects. But I
do love how Darren claimed to have had an AME apprenticeship without
ever realising that such apprenticeships are at technician (Cert IV)
level and had a commensurately higher entry level - year 10. He didn't
even realise that an AME apprenticeship required 1280 hours over 4 years
at TAFE rather than the standard 960 hours over 3 years of a standard
trade apprenticeship. I laughed when he said he completed all his AME
trade school work in three (3) years - not possible with the lock step
system running at RMIT in that era.
>
> Other states are following WA and NSW's lead and licensing mechanics.

About time. That is mostly due to the feds overriding control of trade
training and qualifications no doubt.
>
> Another issue is that the mechanical trade is also becoming a highly
> skilled multi-faceted one but the reward just isn't there. So there is
> little incentive for mechanics to enter the trade or to stay in it once
> they are.

50% of motor mechanic apprentices in Victoria don't complete their time.
According to VRQA, in apprenticeships more generally, a third do not
complete as at 2014. That is unchanged from 2004 and likely unchanged
still even though more money has been poured into trade training.
No, it's getting worse according to this rather current article;

https://www.news.com.au/finance/work/at-work/tip-of-the-iceberg-insiders-reveal-dark-truth-behind-apprenticeship-crisis/news-story/8f2cd147c52389077e845c9de0af532c#

The latest completion and attrition rates for apprentices and
trainees report released this week by the National Centre for
Vocational Education Research found that individual completion
rates for apprentices and trainees who started training in
2018 decreased to 55.8 per cent, down 0.8 percentage points
compared with those who commenced the year prior.

>
> Especially in Victoria where they are competing with noddies that have
> no training, no experience, no qualifications and are grossly
> incompetent that can charge the same as highly skilled, qualified and
> highly competent technicians.

Worse, those unqualified incompetents are like scab labour and undercut
the opportunities for properly trained and qualified mechanics to fight
for better pay deals.

--
Xeno

Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
(with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)

On 6/3/2024 11:56 am, Trevor Wilson wrote:
> On 5/03/2024 12:27 pm, Xeno wrote:
>> On 5/3/2024 11:50 am, Nomen Nescio wrote:
>>> but where are they going to live, with the housing crisis
>>> put a bunk bed in the workshop?
>>>
>> Nothing new here. The mining industry is already importing motor
>> mechanics from OS, specifially China, for work in the mining industry.
>> China has been sending *tradesmen* abroad for yonks to work on belt
>> and road projects and now, with some Australian mining companies
>> *owned* by Chinese, they are being brought in by the hundreds to work
>> on these remote projects. Because they are remote, the average Aussie
>> never sees them.
>>
>> I have been saying for some time now that current motor mechanics in
>> this country need to retrained, reskilled and *licenced* in hybrid,
>> PHEV and BEV vehicles because of the high voltages (200V - 800V AC/DC)
>> involved. We have enough *fake* motor mechanics (hello Darren!) as it
>> is, fakes who pretend they are trained and qualified, fakes who claim
>> skills and qualifications they do not possess.
>>
>> Australia needs to make trades attractive to potential apprentices as
>> well as providing broader and better training along with *licencing*
>> to keep the shonks out.
>>
>
> **Agreed. Modern cars have been getting more and more complex, requiring

Complex but in a different non-traditional fields - electronics,
computers and networking. A lot of the *current* mechanics are flummoxed
by electrical issues, let alone *electronics*.

> far higher levels of skill and knowledge of mechanics. My own mechanic
> tells me that there is a huge shortage of decent mechanics. He lost one

Been like that for 40 years or more.

> of his guys and has had a hard time finding a quality replacement.

I wish him luck, it's not going to improve any time soon. From the
moment any *change* is initiated, it takes 10 years or more to see that
change reflected in the field. We were discussing this issue at seminars
in the 80s, the only major change since then has been nationalisation of
trade training and, from my perspective, a watering down of the trade
syllabus. The other issue, and it has been around since the 80s, is the
inability of the secondary education system to prepare people for a
trade, *any* trade. In TAFE I found myself dealing with students who
seemed to have slipped through the system without a clue in STEM
subjects. At least I can say that the Tassie education system prepared
me well for a career in the trades back in the 60s. FFS, literacy is a
huge issue these days and any tradie needs to be highly literate - not
only to learn the trade initially but to keep themselves on top of
technology developments in these times of rapid changes. Hybrids and
BEVs are just a sampling of what's to come.

--
Xeno

Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
(with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)

On 6/03/2024 5:23 pm, Keithr0 wrote:
> On 6/03/2024 12:29 pm, Noddy wrote:
>>
>> Very few people these days want to do the job, and it's not just
>> mechanics. Trades all across the board are suffering from a lack of
>> interested parties. Exactly why that is I can't tell you, but there is
>> a distinct pattern of trade applicants on a downward spiral.
>
> One of my grandsons was training to be a surveyor. He was 6 months away
> from getting his diploma, but had been waiting nearly 2 years for TAFE
> to provide that last part so that he could qualify.
>
> So he said bugger it to that, and now works for NSW education taking
> kids on adventure courses. Actually, I think that he likes it better
> than surveying.

Don't blame him.

--
--
--
Regards,
Noddy.

On 6/3/2024 8:29 pm, Noddy wrote:
> On 6/03/2024 5:23 pm, Keithr0 wrote:
>> On 6/03/2024 12:29 pm, Noddy wrote:
>>>
>>> Very few people these days want to do the job, and it's not just
>>> mechanics. Trades all across the board are suffering from a lack of
>>> interested parties. Exactly why that is I can't tell you, but there
>>> is a distinct pattern of trade applicants on a downward spiral.
>>
>> One of my grandsons was training to be a surveyor. He was 6 months
>> away from getting his diploma, but had been waiting nearly 2 years for
>> TAFE to provide that last part so that he could qualify.
>>
>> So he said bugger it to that, and now works for NSW education taking
>> kids on adventure courses. Actually, I think that he likes it better
>> than surveying.
>
> Don't blame him.
>
Says the clown who couldn't even *qualify* to sign on to any
apprenticeship ever.

--
Xeno

Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
(with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)

On 6/03/2024 10:56 am, Trevor Wilson wrote:
> On 5/03/2024 12:27 pm, Xeno wrote:
>> On 5/3/2024 11:50 am, Nomen Nescio wrote:
>>> but where are they going to live, with the housing crisis
>>> put a bunk bed in the workshop?
>>>
>> Nothing new here. The mining industry is already importing motor
>> mechanics from OS, specifially China, for work in the mining industry.
>> China has been sending *tradesmen* abroad for yonks to work on belt
>> and road projects and now, with some Australian mining companies
>> *owned* by Chinese, they are being brought in by the hundreds to work
>> on these remote projects. Because they are remote, the average Aussie
>> never sees them.

If the visa system is allowing masses of cheap Chinese mining workers
in, why are FIFO workers in such demand and getting paid so much money?

>> I have been saying for some time now that current motor mechanics in
>> this country need to retrained, reskilled and *licenced* in hybrid,
>> PHEV and BEV vehicles because of the high voltages (200V - 800V AC/DC)
>> involved. We have enough *fake* motor mechanics (hello Darren!) as it
>> is, fakes who pretend they are trained and qualified, fakes who claim
>> skills and qualifications they do not possess.
>>
>> Australia needs to make trades attractive to potential apprentices as
>> well as providing broader and better training along with *licencing*
>> to keep the shonks out.
>>
>
> **Agreed. Modern cars have been getting more and more complex, requiring
> far higher levels of skill and knowledge of mechanics. My own mechanic
> tells me that there is a huge shortage of decent mechanics. He lost one
> of his guys and has had a hard time finding a quality replacement.
>
One problem is that a completely different skillset will be required,
and there will be a proportion of the population of mechanics who will
be unable or unwilling to master it. Maybe there will be an opportunity
to set up specialised shops in the same way that there are transmission
and brake shops. There could also be an opportunity to be an independent
specialist making cars safe for panel shops.

On 6/3/2024 11:56 am, Trevor Wilson wrote:
> On 5/03/2024 12:27 pm, Xeno wrote:
>> On 5/3/2024 11:50 am, Nomen Nescio wrote:
>>> but where are they going to live, with the housing crisis
>>> put a bunk bed in the workshop?
>>>
>> Nothing new here. The mining industry is already importing motor
>> mechanics from OS, specifially China, for work in the mining industry.
>> China has been sending *tradesmen* abroad for yonks to work on belt
>> and road projects and now, with some Australian mining companies
>> *owned* by Chinese, they are being brought in by the hundreds to work
>> on these remote projects. Because they are remote, the average Aussie
>> never sees them.
>>
>> I have been saying for some time now that current motor mechanics in
>> this country need to retrained, reskilled and *licenced* in hybrid,
>> PHEV and BEV vehicles because of the high voltages (200V - 800V AC/DC)
>> involved. We have enough *fake* motor mechanics (hello Darren!) as it
>> is, fakes who pretend they are trained and qualified, fakes who claim
>> skills and qualifications they do not possess.
>>
>> Australia needs to make trades attractive to potential apprentices as
>> well as providing broader and better training along with *licencing*
>> to keep the shonks out.
>>
>
> **Agreed. Modern cars have been getting more and more complex, requiring
> far higher levels of skill and knowledge of mechanics. My own mechanic
> tells me that there is a huge shortage of decent mechanics. He lost one
> of his guys and has had a hard time finding a quality replacement.
>

Probably went off to work in the mines or maybe he became a traffic
controller earning considerably more than an experienced mechanic.
Young bloke who lives near me was working at a nearby Mitsubishi
dealership when Covid happened, because he was the last one hired he was
the first to be laid off, he had to find a job so he got one working as
a traffic controller taking home $400 per week more than he was earning
as a mechanic so its not difficult to work out why they can't find
mechanics.

--
Daryl

On 6/3/2024 1:22 pm, Noddy wrote:
> On 6/03/2024 8:43 am, Daryl wrote:
>> On 5/3/2024 11:50 am, Nomen Nescio wrote:
>>> but where are they going to live, with the housing crisis
>>> put a bunk bed in the workshop?
>>>
>> LOL, I read the article in the news yesterday about the EV mechanic
>> shortage which doesn't surprise me at all, my friends have to drive
>> 20km to get their PHEV Hyundai serviced because no one locally (even
>> the dealer that sold the car) is qualified to service it.
>
> ROTFL :) What a fuck up :)
>
> You'd think the manufacturer would have organised in house training
> *before* granting dealerships approval to sell the fucking things.
>
> Hahahahaah :)

Its pretty poor, bought the car in Melton but have to take it to
Caroline Springs to get it serviced, same people own both dealership
locations so it makes even less sense.
>
>> The crash repair industry is having huge problems getting anyone to
>> repair crashed EV's, some won't touch them because they think they are
>> too dangerous making the problem even worse.
>> EV body parts supply is also big problem apparently.
>
> If only someone could explain how buying an EV makes any kind of sense....
>

I think that you will be waiting a long time for that explanation:-)

--
Daryl

On 6/3/2024 9:38 pm, Keithr0 wrote:
> On 6/03/2024 10:56 am, Trevor Wilson wrote:
>> On 5/03/2024 12:27 pm, Xeno wrote:
>>> On 5/3/2024 11:50 am, Nomen Nescio wrote:
>>>> but where are they going to live, with the housing crisis
>>>> put a bunk bed in the workshop?
>>>>
>>> Nothing new here. The mining industry is already importing motor
>>> mechanics from OS, specifially China, for work in the mining
>>> industry. China has been sending *tradesmen* abroad for yonks to work
>>> on belt and road projects and now, with some Australian mining
>>> companies *owned* by Chinese, they are being brought in by the
>>> hundreds to work on these remote projects. Because they are remote,
>>> the average Aussie never sees them.
>
> If the visa system is allowing masses of cheap Chinese mining workers
> in, why are FIFO workers in such demand and getting paid so much money?

Because the visa system has *limits* and the needs of mining companies
are significantly greater.
>
>>> I have been saying for some time now that current motor mechanics in
>>> this country need to retrained, reskilled and *licenced* in hybrid,
>>> PHEV and BEV vehicles because of the high voltages (200V - 800V
>>> AC/DC) involved. We have enough *fake* motor mechanics (hello
>>> Darren!) as it is, fakes who pretend they are trained and qualified,
>>> fakes who claim skills and qualifications they do not possess.
>>>
>>> Australia needs to make trades attractive to potential apprentices as
>>> well as providing broader and better training along with *licencing*
>>> to keep the shonks out.
>>>
>>
>> **Agreed. Modern cars have been getting more and more complex,
>> requiring far higher levels of skill and knowledge of mechanics. My
>> own mechanic tells me that there is a huge shortage of decent
>> mechanics. He lost one of his guys and has had a hard time finding a
>> quality replacement.
>>
> One problem is that a completely different skillset will be required,

Ahem, that *different skillset* has been *needed* for over 30 years. I
mentioned 3 specific areas in another post - electronics, computers &
networking. I trained for those needs in the early years of the 80s at
teachers college. Not a lot of good if the apprentices aren't signing on
and less so if those who do aren't surviving in the workplace and
dropping out before completion.

> and there will be a proportion of the population of mechanics who will
> be unable or unwilling to master it. Maybe there will be an opportunity

That's why there is a need to employ an entirely different cohort into
the trade with a higher educational level and good grounding in stem
subjects. The problem with that is that a person who completes year 12
and an array of stem subjects will see a better future by going to uni.

> to set up specialised shops in the same way that there are transmission
> and brake shops. There could also be an opportunity to be an independent
> specialist making cars safe for panel shops.

Those opportunities have been there for decades.

--
Xeno

Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
(with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)

On 6/3/2024 9:38 pm, Keithr0 wrote:
> On 6/03/2024 10:56 am, Trevor Wilson wrote:
>> On 5/03/2024 12:27 pm, Xeno wrote:
>>> On 5/3/2024 11:50 am, Nomen Nescio wrote:
>>>> but where are they going to live, with the housing crisis
>>>> put a bunk bed in the workshop?
>>>>
>>> Nothing new here. The mining industry is already importing motor
>>> mechanics from OS, specifially China, for work in the mining
>>> industry. China has been sending *tradesmen* abroad for yonks to work
>>> on belt and road projects and now, with some Australian mining
>>> companies *owned* by Chinese, they are being brought in by the
>>> hundreds to work on these remote projects. Because they are remote,
>>> the average Aussie never sees them.
>
> If the visa system is allowing masses of cheap Chinese mining workers
> in, why are FIFO workers in such demand and getting paid so much money?
>
>>> I have been saying for some time now that current motor mechanics in
>>> this country need to retrained, reskilled and *licenced* in hybrid,
>>> PHEV and BEV vehicles because of the high voltages (200V - 800V
>>> AC/DC) involved. We have enough *fake* motor mechanics (hello
>>> Darren!) as it is, fakes who pretend they are trained and qualified,
>>> fakes who claim skills and qualifications they do not possess.
>>>
>>> Australia needs to make trades attractive to potential apprentices as
>>> well as providing broader and better training along with *licencing*
>>> to keep the shonks out.
>>>
>>
>> **Agreed. Modern cars have been getting more and more complex,
>> requiring far higher levels of skill and knowledge of mechanics. My
>> own mechanic tells me that there is a huge shortage of decent
>> mechanics. He lost one of his guys and has had a hard time finding a
>> quality replacement.
>>
> One problem is that a completely different skillset will be required,
> and there will be a proportion of the population of mechanics who will
> be unable or unwilling to master it. Maybe there will be an opportunity
> to set up specialised shops in the same way that there are transmission
> and brake shops. There could also be an opportunity to be an independent
> specialist making cars safe for panel shops.

That's already happening but at the moment there aren't that many EV
specialist workshops.
The problem is that you aren't supposed to do even basic mechanical work
on EV's unless you have done a course to learn how to do it safely.
A basic course that teaches a mechanic how to disconnect the high
voltage battery and make them "safe" is only a short course of around 3
days but more than likely a lot of older mechanics just aren't
interested enough to bother.

--
Daryl

On 6/03/2024 10:15 pm, Daryl wrote:
> On 6/3/2024 1:22 pm, Noddy wrote:

>>> LOL, I read the article in the news yesterday about the EV mechanic
>>> shortage which doesn't surprise me at all, my friends have to drive
>>> 20km to get their PHEV Hyundai serviced because no one locally (even
>>> the dealer that sold the car) is qualified to service it.
>>
>> ROTFL :) What a fuck up :)
>>
>> You'd think the manufacturer would have organised in house training
>> *before* granting dealerships approval to sell the fucking things.
>>
>> Hahahahaah :)
>
> Its pretty poor, bought the car in Melton but have to take it to
> Caroline Springs to get it serviced, same people own both dealership
> locations so it makes even less sense.

It's ridiculous :)

>>> The crash repair industry is having huge problems getting anyone to
>>> repair crashed EV's, some won't touch them because they think they
>>> are too dangerous making the problem even worse.
>>> EV body parts supply is also big problem apparently.
>>
>> If only someone could explain how buying an EV makes any kind of
>> sense....
>>
>
> I think that you will be waiting a long time for that explanation:-)

Not in my lifetime.

--
--
--
Regards,
Noddy.

On 6/3/2024 10:28 pm, Noddy wrote:
> On 6/03/2024 10:15 pm, Daryl wrote:
>> On 6/3/2024 1:22 pm, Noddy wrote:
>
>>>> LOL, I read the article in the news yesterday about the EV mechanic
>>>> shortage which doesn't surprise me at all, my friends have to drive
>>>> 20km to get their PHEV Hyundai serviced because no one locally (even
>>>> the dealer that sold the car) is qualified to service it.
>>>
>>> ROTFL :) What a fuck up :)
>>>
>>> You'd think the manufacturer would have organised in house training
>>> *before* granting dealerships approval to sell the fucking things.
>>>
>>> Hahahahaah :)
>>
>> Its pretty poor, bought the car in Melton but have to take it to
>> Caroline Springs to get it serviced, same people own both dealership
>> locations so it makes even less sense.
>
> It's ridiculous :)
>
>>>> The crash repair industry is having huge problems getting anyone to
>>>> repair crashed EV's, some won't touch them because they think they
>>>> are too dangerous making the problem even worse.
>>>> EV body parts supply is also big problem apparently.
>>>
>>> If only someone could explain how buying an EV makes any kind of
>>> sense....
>>>
>>
>> I think that you will be waiting a long time for that explanation:-)
>
> Not in my lifetime.
>
>
Funny how Govt's etc all around the world were saying that by 2030 they
wouldn't be selling any IC vehicles anymore and all new cars would be
some sort of EV but that's now all changed and its more like 2040 or
even later.
Its all beginning to sound like the debate over video technologies we
had way back when, VHS or BETA:-)

--
Daryl

On 6/3/2024 10:40 pm, Daryl wrote:
> On 6/3/2024 10:28 pm, Noddy wrote:
>> On 6/03/2024 10:15 pm, Daryl wrote:
>>> On 6/3/2024 1:22 pm, Noddy wrote:
>>
>>>>> LOL, I read the article in the news yesterday about the EV mechanic
>>>>> shortage which doesn't surprise me at all, my friends have to drive
>>>>> 20km to get their PHEV Hyundai serviced because no one locally
>>>>> (even the dealer that sold the car) is qualified to service it.
>>>>
>>>> ROTFL :) What a fuck up :)
>>>>
>>>> You'd think the manufacturer would have organised in house training
>>>> *before* granting dealerships approval to sell the fucking things.
>>>>
>>>> Hahahahaah :)
>>>
>>> Its pretty poor, bought the car in Melton but have to take it to
>>> Caroline Springs to get it serviced, same people own both dealership
>>> locations so it makes even less sense.
>>
>> It's ridiculous :)
>>
>>>>> The crash repair industry is having huge problems getting anyone to
>>>>> repair crashed EV's, some won't touch them because they think they
>>>>> are too dangerous making the problem even worse.
>>>>> EV body parts supply is also big problem apparently.
>>>>
>>>> If only someone could explain how buying an EV makes any kind of
>>>> sense....
>>>>
>>>
>>> I think that you will be waiting a long time for that explanation:-)
>>
>> Not in my lifetime.
>>
>>
> Funny how Govt's etc all around the world were saying that by 2030 they
> wouldn't be selling any IC vehicles anymore and all new cars would be

Only one person was predicting the Ukraine invasion by Russia in 2022 in
a book he wrote in 2014. That invasion alone has caused the western
world to have a huge rethink about globalisation and, as a consequence,
battery manufacture, rare earths, et al. The Ukraine invasion has
changed a lot more than Ukraine.

> some sort of EV but that's now all changed and its more like 2040 or
> even later.

That was never going to happen, the logistics of battery manufacture
alone rule that out. Toyota had the right idea, and it sounds *perfect*
in this new era of highly constrained fuel consumption, and that was in
developing hybrids. Massive fuel savings without the range anxiety of a BEV.

> Its all beginning to sound like the debate over video technologies we
> had way back when, VHS or BETA:-)

Nothing like it at all. FWIW, Beta was the best technology and, when the
patents expired, the best aspects of Beta technologies was incorporated
into VHS recorders. Recall, for instance, when *mid-drive* VHS players
were introduced? Yep, Beta technology.

--
Xeno

Nothing astonishes Noddy so much as common sense and plain dealing.
(with apologies to Ralph Waldo Emerson)

Noddy wrote:

>
> If only someone could explain how buying an EV makes any kind of sense....

It has been. Because you are incredibly stupid doesn't alter that fact.

On 6/03/2024 10:40 pm, Daryl wrote:
> On 6/3/2024 10:28 pm, Noddy wrote:

>>> I think that you will be waiting a long time for that explanation:-)
>>
>> Not in my lifetime.
>>
>>
> Funny how Govt's etc all around the world were saying that by 2030 they
> wouldn't be selling any IC vehicles anymore and all new cars would be
> some sort of EV but that's now all changed and its more like 2040 or
> even later.

If it even makes that target.

> Its all beginning to sound like the debate over video technologies we
> had way back when, VHS or BETA:-)

It kinda reminds me of the NBN actually. A good idea on paper, but a
typical government clusterfuck in that it was hopelessly optimistic in
it's objectives and insanely under budgeted to the point where it ever
working as initially intended became a practical impossibility.

--
--
--
Regards,
Noddy.